Weird noise when hot 1100 evo

[Dandanfings]

http://i980.photobucket.com/albums/ae285/dandan-fings/th_A837B124-6AF7-49F1-8BF5-2782224C23A7-3623-0000057F2AD52E8B_zps762ae73d.jpg (http://i980.photobucket.com/albums/ae285/dandan-fings/A837B124-6AF7-49F1-8BF5-2782224C23A7-3623-0000057F2AD52E8B_zps762ae73d.mp4)

When my bike gets to 4 bars it begins to make this odd ginding sort of noise at idle.
It did this the day i bought it and i had my dealer recover the bike and they readjusted the belts as they said they were a bit tight.

But i still have this noise, people on the yank forums think its a buggered bearing on the cam and that my engine is a lemon :eyepopping:

Dont really have the time to be taking it back and forth from the dealer.
I will have to refit my stock exhaust and reconnect the o2 sensors which is a pain also,

So any ideas?

[Qba]

The same here. I mentioned it to dealer twice. They supposedly checked it and didn't find anything. It improved after first service, but after a while problem came back. Someone else here had the same problem - not sure if it had been sorted though.

[Cobra88]

Cant see video or hear sound as I don't have a photobucket account.

[Darren69]

Have you tried with the belt covers off and checked it's not rubbing anywhere? I'd have thought if it were a bearing problem it would be apparent whenever the engine was running.

[Nickj]

Cant see video or hear sound as I don't have a photobucket account.

LOL It's hard to hear a grinding over the rest of the engine and exhaust noise.

Make sure you've got this in writing somewhere so when they check for this noise and then say it's nothing there is a record. If you get a problem with this later then it's an existing fault dating from the time it started (or when you have a first record with some provenance) and they will be obliged to sort it even if it's after the end of the warranty period.

[Flip]

Sounds a bit daft but you could try sticking a screwdriver in various places around the engine and putting your ear to the handle. You might get an idea on the different sounds and possibly the area where the noise is coming from.

If it's a bearing rumbling you really don't want it to break up in there coz it will make a horrible mess, likewise if, as Darren said it's a belt rubbing it could break without warning with horrible consequences- although I would have thought that would make the noise from start up.

I am guessing it is making the noise all the time but you can't hear it when riding or are you 100% certain it is only at idle?

In the meantime try and get some kind of proof that the dealer has looked and confirmed it is firstly safe to ride, not doing further damage and if it all goes horribly wrong they will sort it and not make excuses.

Personally, I would print out a little sheet with tick boxes for them to sign against each time you pick the bike up- if they won't sign then that might tell you something?

[Dandanfings]

Ducati themselves and the dealer are both aware of the problem.
if anything were to happen i have emails and also a little invoice from the dealer stating belts readjusted due to noise.

So if it goes bang its on Ducati not me!.

At least i know somebody else had the same noise.

[wezrvf]

Hi guys,

I MAY have developed this problem too. Did you get any further with Ducati? Do you still have the noise?

Any help would be good.

Cheers

[wezrvf]

Seems like a bearing whine/ rub

[Dukedesmo]

Hard to hear on a video but sounds OK to me, my 916 makes much more mechanical noise but I wear earplugs otherwise I'd think it was ready to explode... :chuckle:

[wezrvf]

well after speaking with Ducati it seems something could be amiss whoever they are happy for me to make the 20 mile trip on it for them to check out and don't seem to think anything is going to go bang !!

I am running it up in the morning and will let you know what the update is.

[alan s4]

I think that's called "character" - my S4 has loads - just ride and enjoy:mand:

[wezrvf]

It is defo an additional noise to the usual character that is only recent and doesn't sound like the normal chugging of a big twin.

[Dandanfings]

yep im still having this problem, though now it only happens at 5 bars, when its really hot in traffic.
sounds like a rubbing noise.

[wezrvf]

You have had it for a while then. I will let you know Ducati say tomorrow, if anything !!!

[Dandanfings]

So i went for a long ride in town and got the bike really hot 5 bars on the display.
this is the noise at idle...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZufuLk227k

[wezrvf]

Yep, exact same as mine. I brought it to Ducati today, two Ducati garages actually. The first time I couldn't get it to make the noise, it wasn't hot enough after a long motorway run on was only on three bars So went for a ride around to warm it up and got it sounding like a bag of spanners. I brought it to Ducati Manchester and asked if someone could pop out to the car park and have a listen and after the first response of it will be Thursday next week before anybody could listen to it (WTF) I managed to get the service manager to spare me 2 mins to pop out to the carpark. You would have thought I was asking them to send someone round to my house and listen to it. He said there is defo a noise there that shouldn't be. He said it could be a few things but the main ones are a failing main bearing, belt too tight or a chip in a gear or something.

It is booked in for end of the week anyway so will advise this time next week I guess. Total crap.

[SunEye]

I have had noise caused by a belt being fractionally too tight. First noticed it just after a service. It's an easy fix, so I hope that is your problem.

[wezrvf]

Was it a similar rubbing noise suneye?

I had a service and belt change about 100 miles ago and the noise has been there for a good 60 of them so hoping it is something as simple as that. The chap advised if it gets much worse not to ride it. Which it did so it means it is out of action this weekend. Bummer. Not risking anything though.

[Dandanfings]

i was told the belts were too tight when i sent it to ducati last time and they 'adjusted' it.
It then went to a different dealer for its first service and they said nothing was unusual about it.
Fast forwards to now and i just noticed its doing it again, but only when its REALLY hot.
Before it would happen at 3 bars, now only 5.

So i think its a heat expanding issue and something to do with belts being too tight.

[Mr Gazza]

On my simple air cooled 900, the vertical pot has a slighly slacker setting for the belt because it runs a bit hotter.
I follows that the belt tension is effected by heat.

I am assuming that the bigger engine will get hotter and have more metal in it to expand?

It begs the question, are the mechanics using the correct information to set the belts on that model?

[wezrvf]

funny you should say that as when i spoke with the guy who carried out the service he said he was very surprised how tight the guide seemed to say they should be.

Anyway, dropped off this afternoon so will update in the next 48 hours. Fingers crossed they find something!

[wezrvf]

Well, Ducati have taken a look at the bike and belts seem fine and all the obviouse things look good. They said the noise is coming from behind the clutch and could possibly be the main bearing and would be another 3 hours work to find out. The chap is going to look into if his is chargeable as I said I really don't think it should be.

The bike is 2 years and 4 months old with 5500 miles on the clck. Although technically out of warrenty, I bought the bike 9 months ago from a Ducati dealer and it has a full Ducati service history. Should I really be expected to start paying for repairs??

You opinions will be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks

[Dirty]

Michael Mann is an outstanding director. Manhunter was a much better film than silence of the lambs. Brian Cox was the best Lecktor.

Oh you meant about the bike :) . I guess it depends what's wrong. Certainly a main bearing going after only 28 months could be construed as 'unfit for purpose' but lets wait and see what Ducati say before we get into the what ifs and maybes.

[wezrvf]

i would have thought anything giving up the ghost after only 2 years and 5500 miles may be deemed as unfit for purpose, but then again i do have the innocence of youth on my side ;)

[Dandanfings]

Michael Mann is an outstanding director. Manhunter was a much better film than silence of the lambs. Brian Cox was the best Lecktor.
.

How creepy, i just for the first time watched a HD version of this movie and i thought to myself, this is BETTER than silence of the lambs.
I then watched Live and die in L.A and now have a severe case of 'i miss the 80s'

Ok back on topic...

[Dirty]

How creepy, i just for the first time watched a HD version of this movie and i thought to myself, this is BETTER than silence of the lambs.
I then watched Live and die in L.A and now have a severe case of 'i miss the 80s'

Ok back on topic...

Ha ha, my housemate is doing a degree in music for films. I asked him if they studied 'Miami Vice' as it was ground breaking in that respect (and others). He's working his way through the box set :)

Live and Die in LA is brilliant. I flicked on 'a few good men' the other day, intending to watch a few minutes and got engrossed and watched the lot.


Oops yes, the topic..... Well yes, you'd expect lots of things to last more than 2 years but certainly major components would be more difficult to defend from a major manufacturers point of view than say a side stand or a seat where they 'could' try to claim heavy use.

[wezrvf]

Well, bit of a turn around from Ducati. They say the belts are spot on ( I thought they would be) and the noise seems to be coming from behind the clutch basket and could be a needle rubbing or something. I have no idea what that means. The upshot is they now say the noise is fine and not to worry. Despite being told when they first heard it not to ride the bike.

Going to give it a couple of more times out and if it persists I will not be able to put up with it. Bit gutted but feeling hopeful it will stop, just by luck !! :)

[Ady]

My Evo also does this when very Hot, Two weeks ago i noticed it when the weather was warm last week as it was much cooler it didn't Happen. Mine is on the over run when blipping the throttle. It sounds like belts rubbing to me ?. I will need new belts next service so will have a chat to Snell's when i take it in.
Very Strange :banghead:

[wezrvf]

The service manager did say the belts are resonating which is causing a noise but after around 1000 miles it will be gone.

More than anything it is completely annoying.

[goalc]

The service manager did say the belts are resonating which is causing a noise but after around 1000 miles it will be gone.

More than anything it is completely annoying.

Glad i just spotted this post as i thought i was going mad....

I have a 2 month old 1100Evo and it makes that exact same sound as in your video. I took it back to the dealer and they said they all make that noise - when I pointed out that my previous Evo never made a sound anything like it they said that my previous one must have had a fault!! I plan on taking it to another dealer this weekend to see what they say.

Most of my riding is in central London so it always runs into 4 or 5 bars, but last night I went down to Hampshire and coming back on the M3 it was running at 2-3 bars. As soon as I stopped at the first set of lights I could hear the noise, so it doesn't appear to be heat related on mine.

How is yours now, is it still making the noise now you have more miles on it?

[wezrvf]

hi mate. I have probably done around 600 miles since my last service and like the other chap who has this, the noise is still there slightly but at higher temps. I have not had any mechanical issues that have come up since the noise as started. It does seem to be going ever so slightly but still there. Ear plugs is my solution at the moment. Cant really report much else other than i have been told it is normal so i guess i will plod on and see what happens.

[Black Bob]

I noticed this exact same noise for the first time today. Really hot day at Cadwell Park and I'd just come in from a 20 minute session. The oil temp was showing 5 bars. When you hear it on your own bike for the first time it is quite disturbing. It was enough to make me want to pack it in for the day.

However, after an hour cooling down, I restarted it and it was fine. I took it easy for the next couple of sessions and it didn't come back. Actually enjoyed the sessions more by NOT ragging it as much.

It did come back briefly on the way home too, after having to go through a bit of start stop town traffic and getting 5 bars showing on the display again. After a brief run along some open roads, down to 4 bars and the noise disappeared again.

Just have to live with it I guess, and be a bit understanding when conditions are unusually hot.

[TonyG]

Hi,

Just wondered if there was any update on this thread. My 1100 makes an odd whirring noise on the overrun, but only when engine is hot. Only noticed it after I had a belt change by a reputable dealer. Took it back and they said it didn't sound like a bearing or anything and to just ride it unless it gets worse. So far it is running very well, and the noise hasn't got any better or worse. Just made the fatal mistake of googling whirring noises and got a bit paranoid.

Thanks

[wheelybin]

My 696 has this noise when it gets to 4 bars, first time I heard it I thought it was chain noise bouncing back off parked cars I was passing at the time.( A hissing scrapping noise) It soon dissapears once the engine cools slightly, the bikes got 15000 on the clock and a recent oil / filter change showed very clean oil and no signs of metal of any sort. Mind you living in Scotland , its not often it gets warm enough. Would be really interested to hear if anyone gets to the bottom of this ..

[utopia]

Tony ... In general engineering terms, a whirring noise is often indicative of something being too tight, ie in this case, possibly your new belts.
I'm not saying that's definitely the cause (though its onset, just after new belts were fitted, clearly hints in that direction) but, for peace of mind, I would be inclined to either get the belt tension rechecked (by a different dealer/mechanic) or check them myself.
If doing them myself, I would try to use a good old fashioned mechanical method, rather than rely on the modern, frequency based style of checking.

[Darren69]

As it seems to be the later bikes that have been reported, (M1100/Evo/696 etc) I'm wondering if it could be something inherent in the new engine design? The cam bearings run on plain bearings directly on the cylinder head in those models and not ball/roller bearings like the older bikes? Having said that, a lot of the older bikes have dry clutches which tend to drown out most other noises anyway :)

[TonyG]

Hi,

I'm going to get them checked out again as you suggest. My first thought was they were too tight when the cylinders and head expanded, but was reassured by the mechanic. However, it's still there after a good thousand miles or so. Only happens when it is on 3 bars for a long time, and doesn't sound too horrible, otherwise going like a dream.

Thanks

[TonyG]

I took my bike to Baines Racing today and he had a look. He is one of the best people to deal with you can get, proper mechanic, exceptionally helpful, knows Ducatis inside out and let me stand around and pester him while he did the work, so you get a lesson for free. The belts were clearly not tensioned correctly, one was too tight, and just for balance, one was way too loose. Belts were set up, and noise is now much less, I still get a slight whir, but I guess there must be some noise, and I don't think the carbon covers muffle it much. I'll see how it goes. My thanks to Baines Racing, and I think I was undercharged as well.

[Malo01]

Hi all, I know this is an old discussion but I was wondering if anyone had more info about this whirring noise when hot. Is it something not to be worried about?

[Luddite]

Hi Malo.

I have an 1100 Evo but have never experienced this noise, either from new or with replacement belts. However, I do remember reading about this phenomenon on a German website back in 2014 and it seems that this problem is quite well-known although it doesn't affect every bike.

It seems that this German owner had the cambelt noise at 4 bars on the temperature gauge and reported it to his dealer. Belts and rollers were changed to no effect.

After referring the matter back to Ducati Germany, it transpired that Ducati were aware of this problem and that there was an internal workshop bulletin to deal with it.

According to the service manual, the tension of new belts should be set to 140Hz and used belts should be 100Hz. The lower limit when the belts should be readjusted is given as 70Hz.

The internal workshop instruction told dealers to set the tension to the lower limit of 70Hz in cases of noisy cambelts. This reduced tension apparently eliminates or considerably reduces the noise.

Ducati never revealed the cause of the noise, or even whether they actually discovered what it was.

So this is a known problem at Ducati, although it only affects a small minority of bikes. It seems that it's an annoying problem rather than a damaging one so shouldn't be anything to worry about and your dealer should be able to do something to reduce the noise if it's bothering you.

Hope that helps and you continue to enjoy your Evo.

[Malo01]

Hi Luddite, I couldn't ask for a better explanation, thank you!

I will see what they tell me about it when I will take to the dealer for some other works, at the end, I believe that these engines are famous for making loads of noises and vibrations so they are somehow to be accepted.

Yes, mine too only makes the noise when the temperature goes up high but nothing at normal.

Will post what they tell me there at Ducati!

S

[Cobra88]

Belts are too tight

Mine makes a terrible noise if they are slightly too tight
I now tension my new belts when hot and no more problems

Fit and tension new belts as per normal then run bike till i get 4 bars on the temp gauge
Then i retension to spec when hot (85hz) not 110hz as read somwhere

I think some manuals say 140hz (as luddite pointed out) but i think thats been noted as a missprint like the torque setting for the evo sump plug in some early manual revisions (should be 20nm) i think

[Darren69]

It sounds as if its a heat expansion issue that is tightening the belts. I know from experience that the old 900SS air cooled motors used to expand and snap the head bolts especially the rear exhaust side, so there is a bit of movement going on when they get hot! A slow and gentle warm up is always better.

[Tim88]

I'm not sure if this is relevant but I have always had new belts fitted to my M696 and later my M1100evo while the engine was still warm from riding to the dealer. Could the tension be being set too high if set when the engine is cold? I know that valve clearances should be checked on a cold engine but not sure what the recommendation is for belt change and tension on new and old belts.Very interesting reply from Luddite btw.
Tim

[Darren69]

Belts are too tight

Mine makes a terrible noise if they are slightly too tight
I now tension my new belts when hot and no more problems

Fit and tension new belts as per normal then run bike till i get 4 bars on the temp gauge
Then i retension to spec when hot (85hz) not 110hz as read somwhere

I think some manuals say 140hz (as luddite pointed out) but i think thats been noted as a missprint like the torque setting for the evo sump plug in some early manual revisions (should be 20nm) i think

Was just about to suggest that the belts are checked and tensioned when the engine is hot. That's what I was eluding too anyway. Then just fit some Termis and you won't hear it ! :)

[jerry]

i have used the Audio setting for belts but still find best results using older method 6mm rear and 5mm front on all ducati I work on using m own judgment or sliding allen keys in the gap ...the audio setting seems to lead to belts being too tight ...

[garry]

i set mine definitely too tight, the noise was horrific..

so... from cold using the allen key method.. my lord.. having set them, cold, my bloody washing line was tighter looking !!! i was convinced this was wrong..

started her up without any belt covers on, and ran for 15 minutes, you could physically see the belts tightening as the engine expanded.. pretty bloody amazing to watch..

[Darren69]

And that is why they had so many problems with snapped head studs on early 900 engines, even with a careful warm-up the problem was not cured. Happened to me on my old 900SS, I had a rear one go pop.

I had even heard horror stories at the time that the belts were slack enough from cold that if revved hard it could jump a tooth!

That coupled with the rear head oil starvation issue that's inherant with the engine design (takes 2 mins or so for oil to reach the rear head) is a good enough reason for me to let the bike warm up properly for 10 mins or so

[Darren69]

No warm up issues for those old Norton rotary race bikes! :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P_JkddDw90