Bikesure_adrianflux

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I hope all goes well. I'm glad to be keeping the UKMOC name if we can. Im not fussed anymore about corporate just like a friendly forum with a good stream of knowledge. What I have learnt over the last 19 years has been most helpful and that's what is the club needs to keep. What I would like though is the slight upgrade of the threads usefulness in maybe having just a like button rather than having to write a 10 letter comment. Obviously that old picture thing but I cope with that.
Is there any candidates out there. Have we also still got county reps covered.
I'm definately not standing not that I would win but I see plenty of good people on here done fine jobs over the last few years can have my vote .
 
Thanks for the update Rob , and clearing one or two things up.

I think I now understand how the DOC affiliation effects the way advertising is sold for the forum. Obviously they would only want the company's interests promoted.
You say that leaving DOC would open the options to seek advertising from independents and so forth, I wonder if DUK and authorised dealers would be prohibited by Ducati from sponsoring the forum after we left? The situation with Moto Rapido might change too as far as UKMOC was concerned regarding discount and their ability to advertise on the forum?
(They are and would remain my favourite dealer anyway.)
Would you be prepared to say on here how much the forum costs to run per annum?

There does seem to be overwhelming support for leaving DOC at the moment and I think that is what is going to happen. Even so it would seem that we need at least a caretaker committee of the DOC required officers until the current affiliation expires.
I for one would not want to stand for President under their guidelines (or rules?) Particularly the one about the President having legal responsibility.. That's just way too heavy! Clubs usually protect themselves from that sort of bs with larger committees, insurance and legal advice paid for from subscriptions.

Is there a date of expiry for the current affiliation?

Looking beyond DOC.
The way I see it, we need an officer to ensure that the forum is sponsored from advertising.
An officer who is capable of maintaining the IT aspect of the forum to ensure it runs at least as well as it does currently.
A figurehead for the club, but not necessarily called President nor necessarily regarded as in charge of anything, just making sure that everything is running smoothly and calling elections for new officers when they are due.
I'm sure a new constitution will soon evolve with as easy going a feel that reflects the way UKMOC already feels.
 
Gazza

You need someone with some authority, in the distant past we’ve had to sort out spats between members, step in when members felt victimised and remove a few people all together for being tw*ts and looking to start trouble all the time. Not a pleasant side but necessary all the same.

As for the MR discount, that’s more Wilf and his team being supportive and the relationship they had with Terry (Fatbloke and forum founder), continuing through me and to Rob. I very much doubt DMH either know or care about the discount they kindly provide.

It’s disappointing to see a lack of people offering to step up unless Rob knows more than I, many are happy to benefit from this forum but it seems they’ve unwilling to put anything back in.

Rob - perhaps a new thread specifically for volunteers/nominations may prompt so action?

Ped
 
Pedro said:
Gazza

It’s disappointing to see a lack of people offering to step up unless Rob knows more than I, many are happy to benefit from this forum but it seems they’ve unwilling to put anything back in.
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I think that's a little harsh.

I speak from experience of running events for boat clubs and a pre-internet owners club.

Everyone on here really appreciates the work that's put in by the team, and because of that realises exactly how much time and effort goes into it. And how hard it can be at times.

That in turn means that nearly everyone who would like to be able to step up worries or knows they just don't have enough time and possibly the ability to do the role justice like you guys.

I'd love to have a crack at it, but when family, work, and other commitments have to take priority I wouldn't feel I was giving the club my best or full commitment, so am just not prepared to let everyone down. I'm sure many feel that way and admire you guys commitment more because of it.
In a few years when I'm properly retired I'd possibly consider it, but then probably wouldn't be of the correct age or demographic to take the club forward.

What's needed is a team who are able to reliably commit the time, energy, and enthusiasm to do the roles justice on a regular basis.
You guys have been great at it, but in reality your posts in this thread have actually just proved how hard it is to maintain around normal life.

Oh, and sod DMH and their affiliation rules, it appears like too much grief with too little benefit. Of course MR will continue to give discount to members whatever the situation.
 
Totally agree Nasher, having tackled the weekenders recently I know what commitment looks like so really appreciate the team for the hard work they do all year round ,work ,family and life in general will get in the way meaning full commitment is not possible for many…… and I fear I am already the wrong demographic :chuckle:.

A team that can share out the burden is required, without the constraints and dictates of the increasingly corporate DMH, we are an owners club by definition so we stay UKMOC in my opinion and wave goodbye to affiliation. What have the Romans ever done for us…..Wsb meet and greet at Donington…….discount entry into the museum……support with some freebies and raffle prizes at the 2019 weekender…….annual membership pack…….but apart from these :mand:

This is a great place to be and long May it remain so, I am with Gazza, the free and easy feel is the way to go, the T & C ,s for the current positions are way too heavy.

I am more than happy to be part of a new era Pedro,(indeed I have already spoken with Rob and picked up the baton once more for a Weekender next year) but as an independent UKMOC .

:ukm:
 
Nasher & Moco

My post was intended to spur a reaction not to criticise, I’m well aware of the time needed but as they say, a job shared is a job halved, spreading the load between more people will make it much easier

Ped
 
Not really harsh, very blunt maybe. However this is the reason we decided we had to stand down en-masse, otherwise anyone remaining in post will continue to be tied to the forum indefinitely. As I said earlier, we’ve tried to step down before and are invariably met with no further candidates to be part of this team and a ‘carry on you’re doing a great job’, even though I don’t think we were. Liz stepped up to provide the third required person, when JP sold his Monster and started a family, despite being heavily tied to running a (successful) Classic TT team, serving on the Calne Bike Meet commitee, her job and her family commitments.

Yes, running a weekender is a huge task to take on… which is why Pedro and I (and the club founder, fatbloke, before us) never got involved in the nuts and bolts of running them… but always one with an end in sight, the club/forum would go on, with or without a weekender. Part of this is an endictment of my poor leadership skills (You see, I haven’t been doing such a great job after all, have I) having allowed us to get to this place at all, it was very nearly precipitated three years ago but for my reasonable level of fitness, an Arai RX7 and a Dainese back protector!

To focus on immediate issues: FWIW I agree about the name change and splitting with DMH and their ill conceived edict but assuming a team of three can be found to stand ‘til end of December that can wait and is just serving as a distraction. I listed it in the interests of full disclosure, so potential candidates wouldn’t feel ambushed. Then from January the team/commitee can be whatever size and shape it decides on.

With this in mind I strongly suggest any potential candidates contact me secretly to avoid becoming ‘the default position’ for everyone else. Otherwise the clock is still ticking like an allegory for global warming…
 
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Mr Gazza said:
Thanks for the update Rob , and clearing one or two things up.

I think I now understand how the DOC affiliation effects the way advertising is sold for the forum. Obviously they would only want the company's interests promoted.
You say that leaving DOC would open the options to seek advertising from independents and so forth, I wonder if DUK and authorised dealers would be prohibited by Ducati from sponsoring the forum after we left? The situation with Moto Rapido might change too as far as UKMOC was concerned regarding discount and their ability to advertise on the forum?
(They are and would remain my favourite dealer anyway.)
Would you be prepared to say on here how much the forum costs to run per annum?
Click to expand...

Currently we pay under £600/year for hosting.

As I've already said: Pedro and I have taken care of all the forum support since 2007, so no costs there although that might change depending on who takes over. We have a few other ancilliary costs such as domain name registration which so far has been taken care of through small profits over the years on t-shirts, stickers and slight overpayment of postage for the DOC trinkets (I just rounded up to make sure I wasn't going to money to people who don't understand paypal fees, many people overpay a bit to support the forum anyway) As I said earlier, I'm piecing together all the receipts still.

Mr Gazza said:
There does seem to be overwhelming support for leaving DOC at the moment and I think that is what is going to happen. Even so it would seem that we need at least a caretaker committee of the DOC required officers until the current affiliation expires.
I for one would not want to stand for President under their guidelines (or rules?) Particularly the one about the President having legal responsibility.. That's just way too heavy! Clubs usually protect themselves from that sort of bs with larger committees, insurance and legal advice paid for from subscriptions.

Is there a date of expiry for the current affiliation?
Click to expand...

Ducati UK is a direct subsiduary of Ducati Motor Holding, so yes! and we're currently tied to that until 23:59 31/12/22. I thought I'd made the need for a caretaker committee abundantly clear in the OP? All the bureaucracy makes no legal difference, the CEO is sill responsible under Italian law, remember Frank Williams going to court over Ayrton Senna's death at Monza?

cont ...
 
...

Mr Gazza said:
Looking beyond DOC.
The way I see it, we need an officer to ensure that the forum is sponsored from advertising.
An officer who is capable of maintaining the IT aspect of the forum to ensure it runs at least as well as it does currently.
A figurehead for the club, but not necessarily called President nor necessarily regarded as in charge of anything, just making sure that everything is running smoothly and calling elections for new officers when they are due.
I'm sure a new constitution will soon evolve with as easy going a feel that reflects the way UKMOC already feels.
Click to expand...

We’ve so far avoided excessive formality in favour of a kind of benevolent autocracy, along with (mostly) light touch moderation, to keep the forum friendly and conflict free. Remember the forum started as two guys running an email list until it got too big to manage that way, Can you imagine trying to email your Norfolk group if you had over a hundred people on it?
I've tried hard to 'keep things the way they were', clearly that's now backfiring. I could never have managed commitees, written constitutions, big finance etc. and feel they'll be the death of the easy-going club and forum anyway.

I think you'd want at least 2 IT people going forward, in case something untoward happened to one of them.

The other downside of not keeping it all free is that as soon as annual turnover hits £2000, you need to register as a charity with HMRC etc etc.
Bear in mind that other forums might be a big commercial IT hosting company posing as several little bike forums, you'll find an implausibly similar but 'skinned' format for other makes and models? You pay up or you see an awful lot of inline advertising!

Good luck calling elections... I've lost well two hours to this thread already this morning but not seen any interest in taking the reigns from anyone :-(
 
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Can you point at two(three?) people and tell them they've just been elected? I've done that a few times and to my surprise it works.
 
I could try but I won't.
I can however turn out the lights on my way out, the power to prevent that is in everyone elses hands.
Tick tock, tick tock...
 
It goes without saying really that those who are interested, and/or concerned, enough about it to reply to this thread are possibly the ones who should be volunteering
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.
.
.
Bugger.
 
Well all 3 or my potential suggested members have already indicated that they don't want to or can't fill the position. There are a couple of others who I would suggest but will have to see if there is willing?
 
Once the split from DMH takes place, running this show will be much more straightforward, it essentially boils down to keeping the forum alive and moderating new members (which I do daily on the whole). Perhaps a little cajoling of area reps as well and maybe, if it suits, organising a few things like a little paid advertising to help with costs - if as Rob says forum hosting is around £6-700 plus a few other costs then selling some advert space to half a dozen independants should be pretty easy once a year. Everyone know UKMOC in the trade so it's a cheap source of business for a very modest outlay.

That being said, what the UKMOC really needs is fresh hands at the top, not necessarily to reinvent the club but to guide it and preserve the "nice corner of the internet" it has become. It's an absolute mine of useful info, be a shame to lose that.

Nasher - to your point, you may well have hit the nail on the head, the regular posters on here are quite few in number but they are also the passionate ones who love both the bikes and the UKMOC!! If you want to chat about what I've done club wise in the past and how much time is sucks up, give me a call if you like

Ped
 
there really is no forum without those who regularly post on here, the key members, so if they don't want or are unwilling to steer the forum then there will be no forum moving forward. Yes there are a few new members here and there but it is still a core of half a dozen or so who keep this thing alive, if they don't want to step up and keep it going then unfortunately it will die.
 
I’ve said this before:

The Forum is the Club, the Club is the Forum.


*with apologies for misquoting Frank Herbert
 
I've deliberately refrained from commenting, until now, as I felt the dust needed to settle from Rob etc deciding to resign.

Reading through the details, in the various comments, it strikes me there are several options/ direction the club/forum could go.

Stay with DOC, allowing the core of the club to be changed over time by the dictates of Italy.
Resign from DOC at the end of the year, therefore allowing UKMOC and any signatures to any legal documents the ability to move away from DOC without reprocessions.
These two would require a new ( larger)team to run the club/forum, steering UKMOC into the future.

Close the doors and switch the lights out.
I'm not in favour of this option.

Personally, the set up requires a complete restructuring across the board for UKMOC to move forward, which would allow the first two options to be viable.

Moving away from DOC makes most sense. I've always thought Bologna, over a period of time, would want more control over any affiliated club.The

I think we have time to come up with a viable plan, rather than make a hasty decision.
 
Cut ties with DOC. I can see no benefit from the connection other than the one the DOC would gain over this loose collection of enthusiasts
I’ve been a quite member of UKMOC for a long time, I would hate to see it go, though have not the time or skills to help.
I’ve seen friendly club spirit disappear in other places with these reorganisations with misguided attempts to ‘organise’, any suggestion of facebook involvement would be the death of this place too.
 
Again I think the name change thing is a distraction, the Italians might even backtrack before the end of the year. Although ‘seat of the pants’ polling says the opinion is overwhelmingly divorce is imminent.
 
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