Speeding ticket from our Italian friends!

bigredduke · 28-03-2020, 04:36 PM

In the post this morning. At first I thought it was a scam because the alleged offence occurred in July 2019!

Anyway, after some research, it would appear the Italian authorities have 360 days to issue fixed penalty notices unlike the UK where it is two weeks.

It came to my wife as she is the registered owner of the MX5 we were in on our road trip last Summer although I was the driver.

Details: 87km/h in a 70km/h limit. Fine is 152 Euros

So, my questions: anyone on here ever received similar? Should I pay up or ignore it?

Any thoughts or advice welcomed!

slob · 28-03-2020, 04:56 PM

Don't know if they chase you across borders or 'sell' your debt to a UK collection firm but the first question is are you (she) ever planning/likely to visit Italy again? If the answer is 'yes' or 'probably', the answer is likely quite straightforward I'm afraid.

Luddite · 28-03-2020, 05:33 PM

Some information here:

https://etsc.eu/faq-eu-cross-border-...ent-directive/

Grumpy · 28-03-2020, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luddite

Some information here:

https://etsc.eu/faq-eu-cross-border-...ent-directive/

Interesting reading While on a trip in France last year, I tripped a speed trap. The French police have different guidelines for how a ' safety camera' can be used. The fixed are generally gray to blend in and the mobile can be hidden.
My notice of a fixed fine arrived 3 months later written in French.
I settled the amount as I travel to Belgium/ France two/ three times a year.
According to the directive the fine should have been in English. Trust the French to ignore!

slob · 28-03-2020, 07:08 PM

The French cameras look like wheelie bins, I had a last minute panic going into one small town on rubbish collection day.
At least in France when you see a camera sign it means you are approaching exactly one camera in the immediate vicinity, which is nice and predictable.
We stopped in a German lay-by near the ‘ring once and saw two cops in cammo kit pull what looked like a military range finder on a tripod out of the roadside bushes and stick it in their olive green van, you’d never spot that on the fly.
At least they seem to much further between than the yellow perils in this country.

SunEye · 28-03-2020, 09:25 PM

If the letter didn’t have to be signed for upon delivery where is the evidence of you receiving the notification of the fine?

Has anybody in the UK ever had an unpaid EU speeding fine chased in the UK by a debt collection agency?

In theory I owe the French €97 for a speeding fine that went to court in my absence in 2013. I have been to France many times since then. I even live part time in France now. The only thing that I haven’t done is been pulled over by the French police, who I guess could still have my offence on record, but I think it disappears after 3 years.

manwithredbike · 28-03-2020, 09:33 PM

How does brexit affect the cross border co operation and the directive i wonder?

Luddite · 28-03-2020, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunEye

If the letter didn’t have to be signed for upon delivery where is the evidence of you receiving the notification of the fine?

Regular UK NIPS can be sent via normal first class post, there's no requirement for a signature or for evidence of receipt (they're not like subpoenas). So I'd guess the same applies for cross border notifications.

Doggy · 28-03-2020, 10:20 PM

Pay it . End of .

SunEye · 29-03-2020, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manwithredbike

How does brexit affect the cross border co operation and the directive i wonder?

That has yet to be decided, but as it stands the situation is not equal between the U.K. and the rest of the EU. Currently although EU countries can send fines to the U.K. for speeding offences in their countries the U.K. is unable to send speeding fines to residents of other EU countries. In the U.K. the driver is responsible for the offence whereas in most other EU countries the owner of the car is responsible. There is no legal mechanism for the U.K. to compel foreign vehicle owners to reveal who was driving. So the U.K. has never sent a fine abroad, but we receive over 300,000 from the EU.

SunEye · 29-03-2020, 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slob

The French cameras look like wheelie bins, I had a last minute panic going into one small town on rubbish collection day.
At least in France when you see a camera sign it means you are approaching exactly one camera in the immediate vicinity, which is nice and predictable.
We stopped in a German lay-by near the ‘ring once and saw two cops in cammo kit pull what looked like a military range finder on a tripod out of the roadside bushes and stick it in their olive green van, you’d never spot that on the fly.
At least they seem to much further between than the yellow perils in this country.

The French fining system allows you a margin of error of 5kph below 100kph and 5% above 100kph. So travelling at 95kph in a 90kph zone will not get you fined. Likewise on a 130kph motorway 136.5kph will not get you fined. The speed that you are recorded as having been travelling at is the -5kph or -5% speed. So when you get a fine for 75khp in a 70kph zone you were actually doing 80kph.

More than half of the French fixed speed cameras have been rendered inoperable in recent years by protesters.

The French police with their mobile speed cameras will usually hide if they are trying to catch people. You won’t see them until you pass them. Drivers coming towards you will usually flash their headlights to warn you of their presence. They also like to operate on motorways. If the police are just trying to act as a deterrent to remind people not to speed they will be quite visible.

Groovy748 · 29-03-2020, 11:11 AM

Had a fine from Bologna for driving a hire car in a bus lane in the centre of town, was just following sat nav. Nice picture of the number plate and a letter explaining that I would have to reply in Italian to contest the offence. Decided it was probably quicker and cheaper to pay the bill than take a chance next time I wanted a hire car in Italy.

Dukedesmo · 29-03-2020, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunEye

Has anybody in the UK ever had an unpaid EU speeding fine chased in the UK by a debt collection agency?

Not sure if the rules have changed with the recent 'sharing' (ie our gov selling/giving details to Euro law enforcement) but I got stopped speeding a few years back in France and was given an on the spot fine (around £200).

A couple of months later I received a letter from the French courts asking for an extra £20 or so, I 'filed' said letter and have heard nothing more about it.

I have been back to France by car a few times since with no bother but not in that vehicle and not been stopped by Police which, I guess would be the only way they could catch up with me if they were so inclined.

I don't think I'm on Interpol's most wanted list though.

As for Italian fines in the post, I would 'file' the same way that I did with the French letter (Fnarr) above, actually given the shortage of toilet paper...

Stinger101 · 30-03-2020, 09:31 AM

I've had two similar from the Italian police over a few years. One speeding and one bus lane infringement. 2 trips and they take a long time to get to you, and to sort.
Only yesterday did I find the correspondence and throw it in the recycling. Thinking 2.5 years was long enough after I paid it and I had their acknowledgement, to feel safe.

I tried for months to duck out of the first one, they charged it to my credit card anyway in the end, about a year after the first letter. I was in a hire car so I couldn't escape it. I tried!
I kept sending it back saying I couldn't read Italian. Seemed just to delay things a few months and then the fine was around £160/70 Euros or so. The second bus lane infringement in Bologna - I paid straight away as I knew I'd done it Guv! Another hire car.....

bigredduke · 30-03-2020, 07:22 PM

Thanks for all the input. Having taken advice from a variety of sources, I decided the best course of action was to pay up. We love Italy &, when the current horrendous situation is eventually resolved, we will go back. Even if the car is different, Mrs BRD has a personal plate which will be transferred so we are probably sitting ducks for the authorities.

However, given that they have 360 days to issue a fine (& apparently that's from the date of obtaining your details not the date of the alleged offence), I hope there aren't any more unpleasant missives in the pipeline!

28-03-2020, 04:36 PM	#1
bigredduke Nothing to see here Join Date: May 2005 Location: brough Bike: M1100evo Posts: 1,546	Speeding ticket from our Italian friends! In the post this morning. At first I thought it was a scam because the alleged offence occurred in July 2019! Anyway, after some research, it would appear the Italian authorities have 360 days to issue fixed penalty notices unlike the UK where it is two weeks. It came to my wife as she is the registered owner of the MX5 we were in on our road trip last Summer although I was the driver. Details: 87km/h in a 70km/h limit. Fine is 152 Euros So, my questions: anyone on here ever received similar? Should I pay up or ignore it? Any thoughts or advice welcomed!

28-03-2020, 09:33 PM	#7
manwithredbike aka Phil Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: derry Bike: M900 Posts: 376	How does brexit affect the cross border co operation and the directive i wonder? __________________ .. ~

29-03-2020, 11:11 AM	#12
Groovy748 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Bristol Bike: M900 Posts: 14	Italian Fines Had a fine from Bologna for driving a hire car in a bus lane in the centre of town, was just following sat nav. Nice picture of the number plate and a letter explaining that I would have to reply in Italian to contest the offence. Decided it was probably quicker and cheaper to pay the bill than take a chance next time I wanted a hire car in Italy.

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28-03-2020, 04:56 PM	#2
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,707	Don't know if they chase you across borders or 'sell' your debt to a UK collection firm but the first question is are you (she) ever planning/likely to visit Italy again? If the answer is 'yes' or 'probably', the answer is likely quite straightforward I'm afraid.

28-03-2020, 05:33 PM	#3
Luddite Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Southampton Bike: M1100evo Posts: 2,465	Some information here: https://etsc.eu/faq-eu-cross-border-...ent-directive/

28-03-2020, 07:08 PM	#5
slob . Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: East London Bike: Multiple Monsters Posts: 9,707	The French cameras look like wheelie bins, I had a last minute panic going into one small town on rubbish collection day. At least in France when you see a camera sign it means you are approaching exactly one camera in the immediate vicinity, which is nice and predictable. We stopped in a German lay-by near the ‘ring once and saw two cops in cammo kit pull what looked like a military range finder on a tripod out of the roadside bushes and stick it in their olive green van, you’d never spot that on the fly. At least they seem to much further between than the yellow perils in this country.

28-03-2020, 09:25 PM	#6
SunEye Registered User Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Bognor Regis Bike: Other Ducati Posts: 589	If the letter didn’t have to be signed for upon delivery where is the evidence of you receiving the notification of the fine? Has anybody in the UK ever had an unpaid EU speeding fine chased in the UK by a debt collection agency? In theory I owe the French €97 for a speeding fine that went to court in my absence in 2013. I have been to France many times since then. I even live part time in France now. The only thing that I haven’t done is been pulled over by the French police, who I guess could still have my offence on record, but I think it disappears after 3 years.

28-03-2020, 10:20 PM	#9
Doggy Registered User Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Kent Bike: M796 Posts: 510	Pay it . End of .

30-03-2020, 09:31 AM	#14
Stinger101 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Alcester Bike: M1200s Posts: 240	I've had two similar from the Italian police over a few years. One speeding and one bus lane infringement. 2 trips and they take a long time to get to you, and to sort. Only yesterday did I find the correspondence and throw it in the recycling. Thinking 2.5 years was long enough after I paid it and I had their acknowledgement, to feel safe. I tried for months to duck out of the first one, they charged it to my credit card anyway in the end, about a year after the first letter. I was in a hire car so I couldn't escape it. I tried! I kept sending it back saying I couldn't read Italian. Seemed just to delay things a few months and then the fine was around £160/70 Euros or so. The second bus lane infringement in Bologna - I paid straight away as I knew I'd done it Guv! Another hire car.....

30-03-2020, 07:22 PM	#15
bigredduke Nothing to see here Join Date: May 2005 Location: brough Bike: M1100evo Posts: 1,546	Thanks for all the input. Having taken advice from a variety of sources, I decided the best course of action was to pay up. We love Italy &, when the current horrendous situation is eventually resolved, we will go back. Even if the car is different, Mrs BRD has a personal plate which will be transferred so we are probably sitting ducks for the authorities. However, given that they have 360 days to issue a fine (& apparently that's from the date of obtaining your details not the date of the alleged offence), I hope there aren't any more unpleasant missives in the pipeline!