UK Monster Owners Club Forum » .: Technical :. » Mods & How To's » Slow Monster rebuild

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Old 13-08-2019, 07:26 PM   #976
350TSS
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Early on today I decided that I had to do something about the fork/tank clash, whilst I could undoubtedly have adjusted the lock stops and still had a rideable bike, Monsters are not best known for their tight turning circles and I would have regretted not doing it ever after. Rather than carving lumps out of the tank top in the affected area (I do not know what effect the attachment of clip-ons to the fork legs would have) I decided to see if I could move the tank base rearwards. The tank is located on 4 male/female rubber iisolation mounts which sit in recesses in the tank base above the central cross brace and above the frame bridge at the back. The tank needs to move rearward by about 10mm. This is achievable without compromising the lower line of the tank vis-a-vis the frame rails. The vertical cylinder spark plug cut out will end up being slightly off centre but raising the tank by about 6mm makes this barely noticeable. With regard to the tank mounts themselves the current indents can be filled with resin and the indents re-made 10mm further forward on the base.
There were however 2 significant problems with moving the tank backwards.
1. Because the rear top rails are initially angled inwards towards the back of the bike, what was a potential clash with the petrol tap became an insurmountable clash:
2. Just in front of the rear bridge I had moulded in a full width “low point” which would enable petrol to flow between both halves of the tank and on I could mount the petrol tap Moving the base backwards caused this low point to clash with the bridge.
So the rest of the day involved cutting out the existing petrol tap boss and modifying the “low point” to (hopefully) give clearance for the tank re-location.



After cutting the holes I trimmed up some 1mm polypropylene and hot glue gunned it in place to provide something to lay the resin and CF on.


I will have to wait until tomorrow when the resin will have cured and then I can see whether it has worked.
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Old 13-08-2019, 08:57 PM   #977
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Old 14-08-2019, 07:21 PM   #978
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Something always conspires to limit the progress I can make on any one day. Today it was the filler cap. I was due to bond in the “captive nut” the secures the filler neck into the tank and has 5 threaded holes that the filler cap screws to. I was going to drill the holes through the insert the cap sits in and araldite the captive nut inside the tank top. I checked everything worked on the bench, drilled 5 x 5mm holes through the insert and mixed up some araldite. I then spent 30 minutes trying to start the threads on the screws by which time the araldite had gone off and the captive nut was in danger of being very firmly secured to the tank in obviously the wrong position.
On a standard Monster there screws x 5mm screws on the ring around the filler cap, three real ones about 20mm long and 2 dummies that do not secure anything about 10mm long. I did not like the idea of dummies made them into real ones by drilling the thread out and making 2 aluminium spacers to fit between the filler and the tank.
Half an hour was then spent getting the ¾ set araldite off everything it was attached to. I checked the assembly again and everything worked. I decided to get the assembly attached to the tank and aralidite through the lightening holes. Still it would not go on, (WTF, much swearing and scratching of head) eventually I traced the issue to one of the spacers fouling the insert and pushing the filler assembly out of line with the holes and the nut on the back. What should have taken half an hour took the best part of 2 ½ hours. Now bonded in and I am reasonably satisfied with the results.
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The next job was to remove the polypropylene from the modifications I made yesterday, it came off easily and after a light filling to cover up surface indentations I am also reasonably satisfied with the outcome. Couple more filling and rubbing down cycles and this will be done
Re-locating the fuel tap took most of the rest of the day, I managed to part the old tap boss from the resin that was holding it in the previously and trimmed the anchor plate to fit the tap in the only possible place it can go. I hope this location will enable me to switch to reserve on the move without getting my hand trapped in the rear shock absorber spring.

I came up with a better design for the seat mounting just in front of the rear hump and I cut the necessary aluminium but then botched the lightening holes, my pillar drill is not powerful enough so I had to put the work piece in the vice and use a hole-saw horizontally. The centre drill skidded and the holes are not in line so this will have to be done again .
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Old 14-08-2019, 07:24 PM   #979
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Old 15-08-2019, 09:04 PM   #980
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Not so much achieved today on the Monster as it was A level results day and No 1 son got the required grades to go to his first choice university. He worked very hard through the spring and early summer and deserved his place.
I did a lot of filing today, first I went to remake the seat bracket I botched yesterday and then realised I had no aluminium sheet (abandoned road sign) left, so I had to modify the old one. This bracket will have some captive nuts attached to the upper surface and 4 x inverted saddles (2 each side) will be screwed on to sit on the frame. It shall be bonded into the seat structure. The main purpose is to provide a flat base for the saddles to be screwed on to so that they are the right distance apart and parallel with the frame tubes and if necessary packing pieces can be added between the plate and the saddles to raise or lower the seat.
Then I modified my instrument surround to take out the top lug so that the fly-screen can sit over it. I may yet have to remove the lugs on either side to obtain the necessary clearance in which case there is enough meat below the existing holes to drill and tap 6mm to attach the fly-screen to.
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Old 16-08-2019, 06:24 PM   #981
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I was about to treat the inner surfaces of the tank to some ethanol resistant resin when I realised that my fuel filler insert would be a wonderful water trap. If I left it out in the rain it would soon fill up and seep past the locking lid into the fuel compartment. Since water will not flow uphill, the drain I need will have to go through the tank itself. Designing something that drained from ground zero within the filler cap insert exercised “ lonely” (my solitary remaining brain cell) for an hour or so.
Finding a suitable piece of 14mm hexagon aluminium bar was the catalyst for a couple of hours on the lathe. Here are the results:

The top drain mount has a through drilling and this connects to 3 x 3mm holes drilled across the flats of the head as close to the bottom edge of the nut as possible without breaking through. When making it I forgot about 5 x the captive nut plate that retains the filler cap assembly but I simply drilled and tapped it 8mm and screwed the drain into it then sealed the bottom of the thread with araldite. All the ararldited bits will get a coat of ethanol resistant resin before the two halves get bonded together.
I will bond the top end into the insert (obviously on the downside when the bike is on the side stand).
I have put the outlet pip next to the fuel tap because the pipe internal to the tank will have to be connected before the two halves are bonded together and the greater the distance between the input and the output the better chance I have of absorbing the slack necessary to connect them before bonding I.e no loops on the internal pipe. I will protect the internal pipe with some larger diameter pipes where they are likely to chafe on the internal baffles.
None of the last four or five day’s work has been on my schedule of tasks which counts towards the ETTC. This now stands at 180 hours
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Old 17-08-2019, 01:16 PM   #982
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Such an incredible amount of work and the detailed explanations are similarly brilliant. Just 180 more hours!

Hats (OK hemets) off to you sir, you are an inspiration.
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Old 18-08-2019, 12:48 AM   #983
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Thanks Jez, being retired with nothing better to do helps.
Today I rubbed down the filler on the modifications to the underside of the tank and re-modified the aluminium instrument frame. As I suspected the “ears” interfered with the positioning of the fly-screen so they had to go. Two new holes were drilled and tapped 6mm but the lug that the fly screen will have to pick up on is now very small.
Finally I gave the fly-screen a coat of primer to highlight any pin holes in the surface and was pleasantly surprised to find none. Pictures to follow.
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Old 19-08-2019, 06:55 PM   #984
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Roughly hung in place.

And the instrument surround shorn of most of its "ears"
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Old 19-08-2019, 06:58 PM   #985
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I started to make the front seat mounting arrangement, basically copying the original Monster concept of two hooks that will engage with the bridge of the frame and keep the front of my seat attached to the bike.
The design will have to be asymetrical left to right, as the chain oiler reservoir constrains space on the LH side. It consists of a 3mm aluminium plate 150mm x 58mm across the width of the seat with “captive nuts” ( two blocks of 6mm aluminium plate 58mm x 13mm each drilled and tapped 5mm) attached to the uppermost surface from beneath by 3mm csk allen screws.
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This plate will be set in “oasis” foam and bonded/laminated to the CF seat base.(hopefully at an angle that means the hooks are not more than about 25mm deep otherwise there will be too much leverage on the 5mm screws holding the hooks to the 3mm plate).


The hooks will be 2 x 10mm plates shaped and attached by 5mm socket screws to the 3mm plate bonded to the seat. These hooks will extend forward of the front edge of the seat pan by about 25mm to engage in the frame bridge. Getting the shape and angle of the hooks right will not be easy and I foresee a lengthy tweaking process to get the seat to sit right.
Another imponderable is whether the foam and upholstery material extends beneath the lower edge of the seat base or only the upholstery material, this could make a 6 to 8mm difference in the bottom edge of the seat. Ideally the bottom line from the tank should extend upwards and follow the frame line, a 6 or 8mm discontinuity in this line will just look shoddy.
This seems an extraordinarily complex way of doing it, but there are no lugs or bolt holes anywhere near to attach a simple inverted U shaped aluminium bracket and I really like the idea of the seat being QD via a single sprung loaded latch at the back. The hooks are an essential component to that working and mounting them the way I am proposing means that I can adjust the height of each hook by packing them away from the bonded in 3mm plate.
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Old 20-08-2019, 08:53 PM   #986
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Really productive day today, I started by locating the tank breather. Originally I wanted to locate it on the leading edge of the tank blister but that would have meant the entry hole would be about 15mm below the top of the blister and with a full tank and heavy braking the cheapo Chinese non-return valve would have been subject to fuel pressure not just air pressure. That meant it had to be top of the blister mounted. Obviously a central location had to be determined, but which centre - of the tank or centre of the blister which unfortunately are not exactly the same place, whichever I chose would look odd. I settled on the LH end so that the pipe does not get in the way of my turning the ignition key. The original part I made to act as the internal nut would not fit with the depth of CF inside the blister so I had to knock up an 8mm aluminium nut on the lathe.

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Next I turned my attention to the positioning of the cotton reel at the back of the tank which will locate the 5mm bungee cord which will pull the tank down onto the rubber Isolation mounts. I will use the standard Monster over centre latch at the front and with QD petrol pipe unions the tank should be removable in about 20 seconds.
Moving the tank backwards by about 8 to 10mm has compounded a problem I had already foreseen, namely because the frame mounting point for the bungee is the bridge across the frame and this is now about 25mm forward of the rear edge of the tank the bungee will chafe the rear edge of the tank and damage the paint and possibly the CF. I came up with this escutcheon:


It is 0.5mm stainless steel cut from an old cooker hood trunking. It took ages to make, cutting it out with tin snips (they was the only tool I could use) left the inevitable crenulated edge which had to be addressed between the heads of two hammers, which left some minor denting which had to be polished out with 600 wet and dry. It was araladited to the tank and the cotton reel installed which pressed out surplus araldite which then got everywhere and had to be cleaned off with more wet and dry. Still I am quite pleased with the result and the curvatures around the cotton reel seem to look relatively uniform.
Then I spent half an hour or so pouring resin into the recesses for the isolation mounts. I will leave this to cure for a couple of days before re-cutting the recesses 10mm further forward


The last hour I started to make the rear seat latch which will follow the same principles as the other seat mounts. This I should finish tomorrow.
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Old 21-08-2019, 08:44 PM   #987
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Today the plan was to:
a) Finish the rear seat mounting metalwork – completed see below
b) modify the tool tray to permit the central seat mount to rest on the frame – I am awaiting delivery of some plastic saddles so I have had to guess the dimensions in order to make progress – completed
c) sort out the mounting of the front tank latch – little bit of guess work involved here as well as the tank is not yet properly mounted but the latch has, I think, sufficient adjustment to accommodate any inaccuracy in my guesswork – not started
d) coat the inside surfaces of the tank (top and bottom) with ethanol resistant resin -. not started.
The metal work for the rear seat mounting absorbed an inordinate amount of time, mainly because in handling the parts I managed to mark up one of the plates for drilling the wrong way up, I didn’t notice until I trial fitted it together, the hole for the latch locating post was obviously in the wrong place. I rescued it by machining a brass bush from hexagon and attaching it in the right place almost breaking through to one of my lightening/bonding facilitation holes. I raised the bush by 9mm above the plate and countersunk a lead in to the hole to guide the post before the latch engages. It works a treat with the latch snapping shut with a satisfying click.
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A small problem I have encountered is that the powder coating has closed the holes for mounting the latch to the frame. I am frightened of using a drill to clear it as I fear it may snag and tear /chip the finish in the surrounding area. It is a lot worse for the bell crank for the rear suspension, the steel through bush inside the needle rollers will not go between the two mounting lugs. I hate the thought of taking a sanding disc to the finish but I cannot see any other way.
At the moment the critical path is the bonding of the tank and it’s positioning on the frame, I am awaiting delivery of resin putty to do the bonding. Also, I have to wait a couple of days for the resin to cure in the isolation mount indents before I can machine them in a different position. The seat mounting arrangements can only be finalised when the tank is bonded together and correctly positioned on the frame.
So I switched my attention to the engine.
A job I must do is to ensure the provision of adequate cam belt covers. The original rubber steel vertical cylinder one pretty well disintegrated when I took it off so I made some 6mm aluminium plate inner covers with quite a large weight saving. When I failed with my home brewed CF cam belt covers which were designed to work with the aluminium plate I bought some off the shelf CF replacements. These are obviously made to fit the original backing to the cover so I have a gap and nowhere to screw the camshaft end of the new vertical cylinder cover to.
Today, I machined some 10mm round aluminium bar to provide 2 x threaded posts. These posts were 28.5 mm long and my tap was not long enough to thread all the way through so I drilled and tapped one end 5mm and the other end 6mm.
I now need to make the gap filler which I think will be made from 2mm aluminium sheet screwed either to the 6mm plate. Getting the finished product to look half decent will be a bit of a challenge as the original moulded rubber was quite a convoluted shape. I do not think the covers were ever designed to be water tight and judging by the fine grit and road grime I removed when the originals came off I think they were only designed to stop road chippings/gravel getting between the belt and the pulleys.
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Old 22-08-2019, 08:51 PM   #988
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A couple of minor setbacks today, the first is that the Monster tank front over centre latch will not fit my tank, it has too big curvature designed in. No big deal, I would prefer some sort of mechanical latch but I think I will have to make do with bungee, which means I will have to make another “cotton reel”.
The second took absorbed a greater part of the day and is only half finished. I decided to make the gap filler for the cam belt covers. I cut my 2mm aluminium sheet and annealed it (rub with soap and heat until the soap turns brown - job done). I then knocked up a pattern out of an old oak door threshold and played with some clamps to shape it.



After a bit of a struggle this seemed to work. In doing so I realised that the outside profile of the new CF belt cover did not match the outside profile of the 6mm aluminium I had made previously. They were not a little bit out they just did not match within 3mm, it is hardly surprising as I drew the profile for the 6mm plate from the old inner belt cover and this was made of moulded rubber with a large radius curve towards the back plate. The only solution is to re-make both the 6mm plates.
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Old 23-08-2019, 11:29 AM   #989
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A couple of minor snippets ....
I have been told that acetone might soften your frame powder-coat, which might enable you to clean up the offending area without cracking the surrounding coating ....?
You could even try nail varnish remover, which I believe is usually acetone based.
Also, I dunno if I'm reading your seat attachment correctly but I'm wondering if the "hooks" which engage with the frame would be better made out of black nylon rather than ally, for a softer, less scratchy fit ....?
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Old 23-08-2019, 03:10 PM   #990
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Thanks Utopia
I will try the Acetone - I have 2 x 5 litres of it to clean brushes after laying up CF.
Nylon is an excellent suggestion - just have to research where I can buy 10mm thick sheet.
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