Back with a M900 series I - Page 38

Albie · 25-02-2022, 04:59 PM

Albie · 25-02-2022, 05:05 PM

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Mr Gazza · 25-02-2022, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Albie

It was completely carbonated to the point of a crust ......

Excellent.

Reminds me of the time many years ago when my Mum was complimenting her mates new external house paint "Yes my husband has done a proper job, he's Polyurinated it."

Albie · 25-02-2022, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Gazza

Excellent.

Reminds me of the time many years ago when my Mum was complimenting her mates new external house paint "Yes my husband has done a proper job, he's Polyurinated it."

We still cannot figure that front cylinder out. As to why new pistons and rings coming on Tuesday.

Albie · 25-02-2022, 06:57 PM

Hmm carbonised lol. We still cant figure it out. As to why new piston and rings coming Tuesday. Will be back together by Thursday I imagine.

Mr Gazza · 25-02-2022, 07:45 PM

Hopefully on a more helpful note..

Did your oiling/smoking issue surface before or after you topped up the oil at the service station? I wonder if you might have inadvertently over filled in all the excitement? No way of checking now of course.

I'm also wondering if all is well with the breather and maybe the crankcases are getting pressurised?

The only other straw I can clutch is the presence or absence of the oil deflector plate in the oil filter housing. I can't remember if it should be in or out if an oil cooler is fitted? Thinking that maybe if was wrong then it might enable too much oil to be flung up the front pot?

Obviously you staggered the ring gaps when you put it together, but is there a recommended orientation of the gaps? Besides if the gaps are good as you say, then they would be closed when at temperature anyway.

Sure is a heavy deposit on that plug!!

Albie · 25-02-2022, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Gazza

Hopefully on a more helpful note..

Did your oiling/smoking issue surface before or after you topped up the oil at the service station? I wonder if you might have inadvertently over filled in all the excitement? No way of checking now of course.

I'm also wondering if all is well with the breather and maybe the crankcases are getting pressurised?

The only other straw I can clutch is the presence or absence of the oil deflector plate in the oil filter housing. I can't remember if it should be in or out if an oil cooler is fitted? Thinking that maybe if was wrong then it might enable too much oil to be flung up the front pot?

Obviously you staggered the ring gaps when you put it together, but is there a recommended orientation of the gaps? Besides if the gaps are good as you say, then they would be closed when at temperature anyway.

Sure is a heavy deposit on that plug!!

No initially when we got the bike going from rebuild Alec made a comment about a slight puff on start up. We noticed on the mag shoot a few puffs but was not extreme and pulled very well.. After that its first run was the weekender. It was fine all the way there that's 110 miles. It started from really the first ride out. The right gap is only 0.10mm from service limit so although ok I'm not happy with that. But the rear as we thought was very oily on plug .

Luddite · 25-02-2022, 10:28 PM

What plugs are you running, Albie?

Also, I can't remember - did you refurb the carbs during the original rebuild? If they've not been touched I'm just wondering if it's that old bugbear of worn or ovalled emulsion tubes causing rich running.

Albie · 26-02-2022, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luddite

What plugs are you running, Albie?

Also, I can't remember - did you refurb the carbs during the original rebuild? If they've not been touched I'm just wondering if it's that old bugbear of worn or ovalled emulsion tubes causing rich running.

Stock plugs. No the carbs were not but had them all apart this time and all now serviced . Emulsion tubes ok. Jets stock etc. All new seals and o rings .

Dukedesmo · 26-02-2022, 11:27 AM

Looks like oil in the cylinder to make that much carbon. I assume not for many miles as the pistons look clean?

If I read it properly, it's the front cylinder that's oily and the rings & bores seem to be OK, correct?

Is it possible that the oil feed from engine to cylinder to head is somehow leaking into the cylinder? or even the head to engine oil returns? though you'd expect those to leak outwards.

I never did like the oil feed from engine to cylinder base hole on the front cylinder that has no 'O' ring, relying solely on the shim/gasket and any threebond/goop to seal it - though if it leaked it shouldn't get into the engine, more likely run down the side of the bike (plus mine have never leaked - and they've been apart many times!).

No cracks in cylinder or head? and what are the valve guides like with respect to wear, especially the exhaust side?

I know you were looking at guide seals but even if not good I wouldn't expect that much oil (my old Guzzi has no valve guide seals and doesn't use any noticeable amount of oil) although, consider the front exhaust valve/guide sits in a pool of oil so a leak on that one could be more of a problem.

Albie · 02-03-2022, 06:45 PM

Finally this week I got to give the engine some attention. I have had them since Tuesday but having a lot of fun getting my hands on a 749 changing belts

oil filter, oil change, rewire a starter solenoid having to cut back a bodged loom and change petrol filter and seal in the tank and a fresh battery. Started up lovely too.
Anyhow I started this afternoon measuring all the gaps of the new rings in the bores and very pleased to say they are all in the Ducati spec without modification i.e. tolerance should be 0.20mm - 0.40mm and these were 0.35 and up to 0.8mm is service tolerance.
Then I put the gudgeon pins in the freezer whilst I got on carefully fitting the new piston rings. First one I was very cautious but the second one was much easier as confidence grew more. Obviously slipped one circlip on one of each piston whilst off. I did speak to my mentor Alec which way to fit either in barrel then to conrod or to conrod then barrel over. We have a ring compressor and I would do second one he said. So paper towel in the openings and pistons on and gudgeon pins in lovely. Circlips were not so bad to do tbh which was a big relief.
So if I can make it in tomorrow barrels and heads should go on and then I can do belts and an oil changed before it returns home.
I have to admit my body has been misbehaving this weekend and this week and I have been struggling getting out in mornings but mindfulness is keeping me positive and a month of riding but only one tank of fuel is very good. I have also been riding regardless of the weather just because it means work.
I have however sorted my garage ready prepared for rebuild and that's very pleasing.
Thanks chaps if your reading this progress report.

Luddite · 02-03-2022, 08:01 PM

Great work, Albie

Nice to see an elephant again!

Albie · 03-03-2022, 04:08 PM

Have had a most successful day finishing up the engine rebuild. Pistons now encased with barrels and heads all torqued up etc. Alec made me do this work under guidance of course but of course I have done my xt500 etc but this is very important to me not to mess up. So refitting the belts myself and tensioning using a very good phone app ( free ) its called PANO TUNER not PIANO btw where you just flick the belt with the mic near it but don't have noise in the background.
So covers back on and its coming home in the garage next doors van to me tonight as he lives near me. Very kind of him too and most appreciated .
So next phase will start as soon as I have enough money to get the frame painted again after I get it blasted locally but it has to be done in a quick order too.
I am really grateful of my can I say opportunity to have a workplace position here at Pro Team as I really didn't expect to be able to do this straight away and now I have done so I can get back to learning what I want to do as in other peoples bikes not my own because its a distraction.
Thanks chaps again for following this resurrected thread.

Albie · 03-03-2022, 07:16 PM

I needed to share this as came home as expected.... but believe it or not that trolley is made by Pierobon. I mocked Alec saying I like your sticker on there thinking it was,a shopping trolley conversion. Er nope it's the real thing

sawmill restaurant castle hayne

crawsue · 04-03-2022, 12:16 PM

Congratulations Albie, looking like a proper job, hope you can get your chassis sorted in quick time....well done.

25-02-2022, 04:59 PM	#556
Albie Fanactical volunteer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent Bike: M900 Posts: 9,030	__________________ http://albies93m900.blogspot.co.uk/ Last edited by Albie; 25-02-2022 at 05:02 PM..

25-02-2022, 05:05 PM	#557
Albie Fanactical volunteer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent Bike: M900 Posts: 9,030	picture hosting free __________________ http://albies93m900.blogspot.co.uk/

25-02-2022, 06:57 PM	#560
Albie Fanactical volunteer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent Bike: M900 Posts: 9,030	Hmm carbonised lol. We still cant figure it out. As to why new piston and rings coming Tuesday. Will be back together by Thursday I imagine. __________________ http://albies93m900.blogspot.co.uk/

25-02-2022, 07:45 PM	#561
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,805	Hopefully on a more helpful note.. Did your oiling/smoking issue surface before or after you topped up the oil at the service station? I wonder if you might have inadvertently over filled in all the excitement? No way of checking now of course. I'm also wondering if all is well with the breather and maybe the crankcases are getting pressurised? The only other straw I can clutch is the presence or absence of the oil deflector plate in the oil filter housing. I can't remember if it should be in or out if an oil cooler is fitted? Thinking that maybe if was wrong then it might enable too much oil to be flung up the front pot? Obviously you staggered the ring gaps when you put it together, but is there a recommended orientation of the gaps? Besides if the gaps are good as you say, then they would be closed when at temperature anyway. Sure is a heavy deposit on that plug!! __________________

26-02-2022, 11:27 AM	#565
Dukedesmo Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Leics Bike: M900 Posts: 2,842	Looks like oil in the cylinder to make that much carbon. I assume not for many miles as the pistons look clean? If I read it properly, it's the front cylinder that's oily and the rings & bores seem to be OK, correct? Is it possible that the oil feed from engine to cylinder to head is somehow leaking into the cylinder? or even the head to engine oil returns? though you'd expect those to leak outwards. I never did like the oil feed from engine to cylinder base hole on the front cylinder that has no 'O' ring, relying solely on the shim/gasket and any threebond/goop to seal it - though if it leaked it shouldn't get into the engine, more likely run down the side of the bike (plus mine have never leaked - and they've been apart many times!). No cracks in cylinder or head? and what are the valve guides like with respect to wear, especially the exhaust side? I know you were looking at guide seals but even if not good I wouldn't expect that much oil (my old Guzzi has no valve guide seals and doesn't use any noticeable amount of oil) although, consider the front exhaust valve/guide sits in a pool of oil so a leak on that one could be more of a problem. __________________ M900, 916, LeMans II.

25-02-2022, 10:28 PM	#563
Luddite Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Southampton Bike: M1100evo Posts: 2,465	What plugs are you running, Albie? Also, I can't remember - did you refurb the carbs during the original rebuild? If they've not been touched I'm just wondering if it's that old bugbear of worn or ovalled emulsion tubes causing rich running.

02-03-2022, 06:45 PM	#566
Albie Fanactical volunteer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent Bike: M900 Posts: 9,030	Getting started Finally this week I got to give the engine some attention. I have had them since Tuesday but having a lot of fun getting my hands on a 749 changing belts oil filter, oil change, rewire a starter solenoid having to cut back a bodged loom and change petrol filter and seal in the tank and a fresh battery. Started up lovely too. Anyhow I started this afternoon measuring all the gaps of the new rings in the bores and very pleased to say they are all in the Ducati spec without modification i.e. tolerance should be 0.20mm - 0.40mm and these were 0.35 and up to 0.8mm is service tolerance. Then I put the gudgeon pins in the freezer whilst I got on carefully fitting the new piston rings. First one I was very cautious but the second one was much easier as confidence grew more. Obviously slipped one circlip on one of each piston whilst off. I did speak to my mentor Alec which way to fit either in barrel then to conrod or to conrod then barrel over. We have a ring compressor and I would do second one he said. So paper towel in the openings and pistons on and gudgeon pins in lovely. Circlips were not so bad to do tbh which was a big relief. So if I can make it in tomorrow barrels and heads should go on and then I can do belts and an oil changed before it returns home. I have to admit my body has been misbehaving this weekend and this week and I have been struggling getting out in mornings but mindfulness is keeping me positive and a month of riding but only one tank of fuel is very good. I have also been riding regardless of the weather just because it means work. I have however sorted my garage ready prepared for rebuild and that's very pleasing. Thanks chaps if your reading this progress report. __________________ http://albies93m900.blogspot.co.uk/

02-03-2022, 08:01 PM	#567
Luddite Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Southampton Bike: M1100evo Posts: 2,465	Great work, Albie Nice to see an elephant again!

03-03-2022, 04:08 PM	#568
Albie Fanactical volunteer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent Bike: M900 Posts: 9,030	Phase 1 complete Have had a most successful day finishing up the engine rebuild. Pistons now encased with barrels and heads all torqued up etc. Alec made me do this work under guidance of course but of course I have done my xt500 etc but this is very important to me not to mess up. So refitting the belts myself and tensioning using a very good phone app ( free ) its called PANO TUNER not PIANO btw where you just flick the belt with the mic near it but don't have noise in the background. So covers back on and its coming home in the garage next doors van to me tonight as he lives near me. Very kind of him too and most appreciated . So next phase will start as soon as I have enough money to get the frame painted again after I get it blasted locally but it has to be done in a quick order too. I am really grateful of my can I say opportunity to have a workplace position here at Pro Team as I really didn't expect to be able to do this straight away and now I have done so I can get back to learning what I want to do as in other peoples bikes not my own because its a distraction. Thanks chaps again for following this resurrected thread. __________________ http://albies93m900.blogspot.co.uk/

03-03-2022, 07:16 PM	#569
Albie Fanactical volunteer Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Kent Bike: M900 Posts: 9,030	I needed to share this as came home as expected.... but believe it or not that trolley is made by Pierobon. I mocked Alec saying I like your sticker on there thinking it was,a shopping trolley conversion. Er nope it's the real thing sawmill restaurant castle hayne __________________ http://albies93m900.blogspot.co.uk/

04-03-2022, 12:16 PM	#570
crawsue Bronze Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Glasgow Bike: M1100evo Posts: 256	Congratulations Albie, looking like a proper job, hope you can get your chassis sorted in quick time....well done.