Another build thread - Ducati 1000 - Page 14

Mr Gazza · 10-11-2021, 03:10 PM

I believe that Oberon clutch servo seals are machined after freezing with liquid Nitrogen?

buzzer · 14-11-2021, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Gazza

I believe that Oberon clutch servo seals are machined after freezing with liquid Nitrogen?

I wonder how they do that... such a small seal must heat up rather quickly?

In an effort to keep the lines of the bike as clean as I can, I have designed the loom to all come together under the tank, which makes it a little messy under there… I also struggled to make a bracket for the fuel tap I am using… I wont divulge how long that little bracket took to make!

buzzer · 20-11-2021, 10:09 AM

into some of the detail jobs now… Somehow I “lost” the brake light switch… I remember taking it off and putting it and the tiny plunger into a plastic bag… after spending a frustrating couple of hours searching (and finding stuff I had forgotten I had!!) I admitted defeat and bought a Hydraulic one, which worked out OK as I needed a new double banjo bolt to fit the brake lines! I took apart the stand switch cleaned and re- assembled and covered the cables with braided sleeving, which I find great. Its important the switch works well as its connected to the ignition… When the stand is down, the engine is limited to 2000 RPM, which prevents you pulling away with it down. Also made up some custom HT leads with copper cores so I can just use resistor plugs.

Finally I finished the ignition trigger… I have made a few of these in the past, but this time when I tried to order the Hall Sensors they were out of stock, with a delivery date of sept 22! There are alternatives, but better the devil you know… A good friend managed to find me 5 in Germany though. I held them in place with some hot glue, and then filled the void with potting compound which I have never used before. if anyone wants to make a trigger, the values of the capacitors and resistors are on the diagram.

the hall sensors are triggered by tiny magnets ( 3 x 5 mm) The south pole turns it on, north off… which means you have to determine the pole of the magnets! this is easily done by floating them on a piece of wood where they quickly align.

Mr Gazza · 20-11-2021, 11:15 AM

Ducati Paddy sometimes has the little switches and bits, but he will tell you where they are available if he doesn't have them at the time.. Very helpful fellow. https://www.ducatipaddy.com/
If you look at the bottom of the list on his "Clearance Items" page you will find that he has some wire guides for early Monsters, the one that keeps the speedo cable off the mudguard. Handy for other things too, I got a couple to control some cables and lines on the Norton.

So when you float the magnet, which pole is which? In theory the Earth's North pole should repel the magnet's North and so it ought to be the magnet's South pole that points North? True or false?

Luddite · 20-11-2021, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Gazza

So when you float the magnet, which pole is which? In theory the Earth's North pole should repel the magnet's North and so it ought to be the magnet's South pole that points North? True or false?

I saw this on QI last week! The pole close to the earth's geographic north is actually 'South', magnetically speaking, so the north end of a bar magnet will point towards the geographic north.

Mr Gazza · 20-11-2021, 02:45 PM

Ah! Thanks for clearing that up Luddite, I'm glad it is that simple, but keep an eye out for the next series of QI as the answer may have changed.

Example; How many Moons does the Earth have? Answer = A Blue Whale..

buzzer · 22-11-2021, 05:29 PM

the magnet question had me googling the answer! its not something I had thought about! every day is a learning day!

Fitted the new cambelts today… I like the Gates carbon Drive app to tension the belts. It measures the frequency of them when you give them a twang, like a guitar string, very sensitive and accurate. I set them to 110 HZ which also “feels” right.

I also went to pick up the oil cooler pipes I had dropped off to have the ends crimped on…I just don’t have the tool to do this. The miserable git plonked them on the counter and said £20… I looked and he had fitted different size ferrules on the ends… when I pointed this out he shrugged and told me it didn’t matter… well it does to my OCD… he was not happy when I refused to pay! This is why I hate putting work out.

PPuxley · 23-11-2021, 08:30 AM

I couldnt get on with Gates app, but it was probably because i wasnt using an external mic. And those swaged ends, I feel for you, the unafflicted just dont understand🙄🤣

buzzer · 25-11-2021, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PPuxley

I couldnt get on with Gates app, but it was probably because i wasnt using an external mic. And those swaged ends, I feel for you, the unafflicted just dont understand🙄🤣

the other trick with the gates app is not to twang it too hard...

into the detailed jobs at the moment, in preparation for start up. The oil cooler was pretty tatty so I left it in a container with some thinners in the bottom for a few days, then washed the paint straight off. As its aluminium and I was going to paint it, I grit blasted it before giving a a thin coat of etch primer, followed by a couple of coats of satin black, which I prefer over matt. It came out really well.

Then onto the carb installation. The outer diameter of the carb inlets are different to that of the fuel filter, so I needed a “T” piece with different size ends. I made one out of brass and silver soldered the parts together. Finally I needed some cable adjusters. I popped to the cycle shop where I buy my bowden cable to make the throttle cables but they didn’t have any suitable. Again I ended up making these out of brass and a couple of bolts. The yellow tube is Tygon, made for Ethanol fuel. its very flexible and I like the idea I can see through it! It works best with Mikalor clips which are quite neat.

Finally I fitted the frame number sticker with the VIN number on, just to keep the MOT man happy. one of the problems with blasting and powder coating the frame is it becomes very difficult to see the frame number.

buzzer · 26-11-2021, 03:24 PM

One aspect of a build I like to get right is the throttle action... too quick and action and its jerky to ride and often heavy... too slow an action and it becomes two handfuls to fully open and I hate that...

I popped the cable on with the twin pull throttle of the Multistrada and it was just too quick and heavy... I needed to take 1mm off the diameter where the cables run. Of course you cant just pop it in the lathe as the cable boss prevents that... I looked at doing it in the milling machine and couldn't see any way of doing it... so I came up with this!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlxAjcEi7Kk

buzzer · 03-12-2021, 12:41 PM

Well I would like to say it started first time… but it didn’t… I would like to say I found the problem in 10 mins… but I spent HOURS looking why it didn’t start. In the end I tracked it down to the fact that I had placed the magnets wrong on the ignition trigger wheel! easily sorted soon as I spotted it.

https://youtu.be/WVhmfhXmU7Q

350TSS · 03-12-2021, 01:09 PM

Were the symptoms no spark at all? If so you have given me hope for my Slow Monster Rebuild (stalled for the last few months due to no sparks).

buzzer · 03-12-2021, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350TSS

Were the symptoms no spark at all? If so you have given me hope for my Slow Monster Rebuild (stalled for the last few months due to no sparks).

No, I had a spark... just not at the right time! for some reason when I drilled the holes for the magnets I got the second hole the wrong side... so it was firing 40 degrees late!

350TSS · 03-12-2021, 02:42 PM

Glad you got yours sorted, my concern was that I put the magnet rotor the wrong way round so the wrong pole(s) were passing the sensors and hence no triggering action.
The FastBikeGear rotor is delrin with rare earth magnets about 3 mm diameter glued/pressed into the rotor axially from one side. Intuitively (no contrary instructions) I installed the rotor with the end of the magnet showing toward the Hall sensors. I think it could easily have been installed the other way round with the blind side facing the sensors.
Would the sensors collect a signal from the wrong pole of the magnet flashing past?
I will swap it round as I have nothing to lose by trying it that way round.

buzzer · 03-12-2021, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350TSS

Glad you got yours sorted, my concern was that I put the magnet rotor the wrong way round so the wrong pole(s) were passing the sensors and hence no triggering action.
The FastBikeGear rotor is delrin with rare earth magnets about 3 mm diameter glued/pressed into the rotor axially from one side. Intuitively (no contrary instructions) I installed the rotor with the end of the magnet showing toward the Hall sensors. I think it could easily have been installed the other way round with the blind side facing the sensors.
Would the sensors collect a signal from the wrong pole of the magnet flashing past?
I will swap it round as I have nothing to lose by trying it that way round.

its easy to test... just wave a magnet over the sensor, if the circuits right you should see a spark at the plug. I took one lead off and put a spare plug in in and did this... the bike backfires and scared the hell out of me

shout if you need help

be aware that those Hall sensors are on back order... not due for 12 months! I managed to source a few from Germany...

10-11-2021, 03:10 PM	#196
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,828	I believe that Oberon clutch servo seals are machined after freezing with liquid Nitrogen? __________________

20-11-2021, 11:15 AM	#199
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,828	Ducati Paddy sometimes has the little switches and bits, but he will tell you where they are available if he doesn't have them at the time.. Very helpful fellow. https://www.ducatipaddy.com/ If you look at the bottom of the list on his "Clearance Items" page you will find that he has some wire guides for early Monsters, the one that keeps the speedo cable off the mudguard. Handy for other things too, I got a couple to control some cables and lines on the Norton. So when you float the magnet, which pole is which? In theory the Earth's North pole should repel the magnet's North and so it ought to be the magnet's South pole that points North? True or false? __________________

20-11-2021, 02:45 PM	#201
Mr Gazza Lord of the Rings Join Date: May 2013 Location: Norwich Bike: M900sie Posts: 5,828	Ah! Thanks for clearing that up Luddite, I'm glad it is that simple, but keep an eye out for the next series of QI as the answer may have changed. Example; How many Moons does the Earth have? Answer = A Blue Whale.. __________________

23-11-2021, 08:30 AM	#203
PPuxley Registered User Join Date: Apr 2021 Location: Reading Bike: M900 Posts: 600	I couldnt get on with Gates app, but it was probably because i wasnt using an external mic. And those swaged ends, I feel for you, the unafflicted just dont understand🙄🤣 __________________ Golf-My favourite game. While my wife plays I'm in the workshop.

20-11-2021, 10:09 AM	#198
buzzer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Wolverhampton Bike: M900 Posts: 392	into some of the detail jobs now… Somehow I “lost” the brake light switch… I remember taking it off and putting it and the tiny plunger into a plastic bag… after spending a frustrating couple of hours searching (and finding stuff I had forgotten I had!!) I admitted defeat and bought a Hydraulic one, which worked out OK as I needed a new double banjo bolt to fit the brake lines! I took apart the stand switch cleaned and re- assembled and covered the cables with braided sleeving, which I find great. Its important the switch works well as its connected to the ignition… When the stand is down, the engine is limited to 2000 RPM, which prevents you pulling away with it down. Also made up some custom HT leads with copper cores so I can just use resistor plugs. Finally I finished the ignition trigger… I have made a few of these in the past, but this time when I tried to order the Hall Sensors they were out of stock, with a delivery date of sept 22! There are alternatives, but better the devil you know… A good friend managed to find me 5 in Germany though. I held them in place with some hot glue, and then filled the void with potting compound which I have never used before. if anyone wants to make a trigger, the values of the capacitors and resistors are on the diagram. the hall sensors are triggered by tiny magnets ( 3 x 5 mm) The south pole turns it on, north off… which means you have to determine the pole of the magnets! this is easily done by floating them on a piece of wood where they quickly align.

22-11-2021, 05:29 PM	#202
buzzer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Wolverhampton Bike: M900 Posts: 392	the magnet question had me googling the answer! its not something I had thought about! every day is a learning day! Fitted the new cambelts today… I like the Gates carbon Drive app to tension the belts. It measures the frequency of them when you give them a twang, like a guitar string, very sensitive and accurate. I set them to 110 HZ which also “feels” right. I also went to pick up the oil cooler pipes I had dropped off to have the ends crimped on…I just don’t have the tool to do this. The miserable git plonked them on the counter and said £20… I looked and he had fitted different size ferrules on the ends… when I pointed this out he shrugged and told me it didn’t matter… well it does to my OCD… he was not happy when I refused to pay! This is why I hate putting work out.

26-11-2021, 03:24 PM	#205
buzzer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Wolverhampton Bike: M900 Posts: 392	One aspect of a build I like to get right is the throttle action... too quick and action and its jerky to ride and often heavy... too slow an action and it becomes two handfuls to fully open and I hate that... I popped the cable on with the twin pull throttle of the Multistrada and it was just too quick and heavy... I needed to take 1mm off the diameter where the cables run. Of course you cant just pop it in the lathe as the cable boss prevents that... I looked at doing it in the milling machine and couldn't see any way of doing it... so I came up with this! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlxAjcEi7Kk

03-12-2021, 12:41 PM	#206
buzzer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Wolverhampton Bike: M900 Posts: 392	Well I would like to say it started first time… but it didn’t… I would like to say I found the problem in 10 mins… but I spent HOURS looking why it didn’t start. In the end I tracked it down to the fact that I had placed the magnets wrong on the ignition trigger wheel! easily sorted soon as I spotted it. https://youtu.be/WVhmfhXmU7Q

03-12-2021, 01:09 PM	#207
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,419	Were the symptoms no spark at all? If so you have given me hope for my Slow Monster Rebuild (stalled for the last few months due to no sparks).

03-12-2021, 02:42 PM	#209
350TSS Too much time on my hands member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Shipbourne Bike: M900 Posts: 1,419	Glad you got yours sorted, my concern was that I put the magnet rotor the wrong way round so the wrong pole(s) were passing the sensors and hence no triggering action. The FastBikeGear rotor is delrin with rare earth magnets about 3 mm diameter glued/pressed into the rotor axially from one side. Intuitively (no contrary instructions) I installed the rotor with the end of the magnet showing toward the Hall sensors. I think it could easily have been installed the other way round with the blind side facing the sensors. Would the sensors collect a signal from the wrong pole of the magnet flashing past? I will swap it round as I have nothing to lose by trying it that way round.