Important: Please Read!

[slob]

Hi folks

Please take a few minutes to read the following:

This is not an easy message for me to post, for those who aren't aware I had a serious accident in May 2019, breaking multiple vertebrae and ribs, puncturing a lung as well as tearing two ligaments in one of my knees and breaking an ankle. What doctors like to call 'life changing injuries'.

I have been working fairly relentlessly to recover my fitness and movement over the last three years, however it's becoming increasingly clear I am unable to continue riding sports bikes and I'm still trying to work out if I'll be able to ride any of my beloved Monsters again. (Please don't start throwing suggestions about bike modification at me, I'm an engineer and mechanic, just accept I know what I'm talking about here and I might scream if anyone else says ‘thumb brake’ without understanding my injuries fully.

I feel I should have stepped down a couple of years ago but have hung on through the worst of the CoViD pandemic, as this was clearly a very difficult time for anyone to take over running a bike club during multiple lockdowns.

After discussion with Pedro(VP) and Liz(Sec.) it's time for us to step down and for the club membership to elect a new board to take over.

I took over Presidency from Pedro in 2010, who'd been in the role for three years and he has been VP since. Liz has been in post since 2018, so it's about time some new blood took over anyway.

Just to complicate matters a little more, Ducati are changing the name of affiliated clubs next year, from 'Desmo Owners Clubs' to 'Ducati Official Clubs'. All clubs will be called DOC|'Club Name', which can't contain the word 'Ducati' or 'Owner', as such we would have to change the name to something like 'DOC|UK Monster' in order to remain eligible for affiliation with the factory. This is something else the membership needs to decide on collectively: Continue as 'UK Monster Owners Club' and split with Ducati or change the name to something DMH finds acceptable. I'm certainly not about to comply with this and then just walk away leaving someone else to sort things out (Mr Cameron).

I sold banner advertising to finance the forum hosting for 2022. As an officially affiliated club we need to elect a President, Vice President and Secretary.

Since we don't charge membership fees, we don't require a Treasurer, if that changes we'd need one of those too.

The current board will continue 'til the end of July, ensuring that I can help anyone with issues relating to WDW22 (22-24/7/2022) and distributing any membership kits, assuming the factory manage to send them out in a timely fashion, unless we can complete this process sooner.

I'd also like to offer massive thanks to everyone who has helped as a board member, regional rep, event organiser or otherwise contributed to the forum since I've been here, you've made this one of the nicest corners of the Internet and I've made some great friends, attended some absolutely awesome events, all over Europe and covered well over 100k miles on my Monsters in the last 19 years. I hope I manage to find a way to continue Monstering!

Just to complete the picture, we have always defined a member as a forum user who owns a Monster and lives in the UK or Ireland (or an expat).
Ducati define a member as one of our members who has chosen to be affiliated with the club through MyDucati app or website (but bizzarely isn't bothered if you even ride a motorcycle). The club needs at least 50 such registered members to qualify for affiliation and a supporting dealer, in our case Moto Rapido.

cont...

[slob]

The current DOC regulations define:

President

The D.O.C. President is responsible for the club, is its legal representative, promotes all activities in compliance with these Regulations, guarantees the democratic management of club affairs, is the key contact with Ducati and the Local D.O.C. contact person designated by Ducati.

Vice President

The Vice President is responsible for D.O.C. activities in the territory. He manages D.O.C. initiatives inspired by the suggestions provided in paragraph 3.8. of these Regulations; prepares the calendar of events at the beginning of each year; organizes activities, informs members of such activities and documents activities (photos, video, texts) to share them with Ducati and the other clubs. He co-operates with Ducati to offer an evaluation of events with a nation-wide audience and helps select partners to be involved in such activities. Finally, he is an ambassador at the club's members regarding issues relates to safe riding and observance of applicable law and responsible behaviour among D.O.C. members.

Secretary

The Secretary to the D.O.C. fulfils formalities relating to club activity, such as the management of the members' details and the data entry in the system. He organizes the meetings of the Board of Management and of club members and writes meeting reports where required. He ensures that members fill any insurance documents/liability waivers for test rides and/or track days. He sets up, maintains and keep up-to-date the D.O.C. document archive.

Treasurer

The Treasurer of the D.O.C. takes care of accounting/administration, prepares yearly budgets and year-end reports; collects membership fees (if any) from members, allocates resources to activities as agreed with the other members of the Board of Management and with the President; manages cash flows from activities and draws up at least annual financial reports for submission to the Board of Management and members; keeps track of revenues and expenses arising out of D.O.C. fulfilments with due care and promptly informs the competent body of any deviations from budget plans. Considering the delicate nature of Treasurers' responsibilities, Ducati encourages clubs to establish a maximum two-year non-renewable term for this office.

I will forward the full regs to anyone who wants to stand up or who just can't sleep.

Rob
--

[slob]

Feel free to PM or email me (rob <at> ukmonster <dot> co <dot> uk) if you want to discuss less publicly but I aim to make this process as open and democratic as possible!

[stopintime]

Rob, I understand. Better you use your energy on you. You have done 77 times more than enough. Thanks!

I've been president for 8 years now. In Norway. Established 1989. Proper website, paid membership, rides, track days. The whole package. Except we drew the line at DOC which we find unprofessional and one-sided. It's made to get them email adresses and leave all the work to presidents. For a pin and two euros off the museum price... They have never done a good job for the clubs. We've told them to forget about demanding specific behaviour from clubs, but leave us to manage the clubs - members sign up for DOC status at Ducati.com, choose a connected club if they so wish and then pay for a welcome kit if they want it. Ducati must do the work and pay the price if they want the email adresses. Not us. If I'm not mistaken, the DOC work isn't rewarding for presidents, so maybe that's a better way for UKMOC too... drop the DOC stuff and focus on yourselves. My point, among many, being that recruiting a new board can be easier without the being DOC.

.... and of course anyone mentioning facebook will not make it through the night. Not suitable as a club base.

[yellowfever]

Rob, I totally understand your decision to step down and also how difficult it must have been for you to take this step. I wish you well for your continued rehab and recovery and hope you manage to stay positive and get to the best result possible.

I’d also like to offer huge thanks to you (and rest of the board) for all your work running the club and keeping it the friendly, helpful place it is over very many years. Sadly I’ve not got over for UKMOC events to see folks in person for some years now, being mostly abroad these days. But I’m sure I’m not alone in finding the forum an oasis of calm on the internet - it’s helpful, caring and inspiring on bikes and life in general. And the knowledge base here is just immense, I’ve lost count of the tips (and parts) I’ve picked up here over the years.

Thanks again and take care,

David

[mickj]

Rob, I'd like to pass on my thanks for the work you Pedro and Liz have done for the forum, I've not been a Ducati owner for long but I have enjoyed being a member here (so far). I wish you all the best for the future. I hope it continues in the same vein with or without the DOC.

[Albie]

It will be a sad day but very understandable. Thanks for doing a grand job all of you tbh. I fully support whoever steps up to the table. New blood will run through the club for sure.

Thank you

[Mr Gazza]

Sorry for my late input into this. It has come as no surprise to me and I’m pleased for Rob that he has finally come to this decision.

I am however surprised to actually hear the full extent of his injuries and have to admire his down playing this over the three awful years. I know it’s been bloody hard and I get the impression that all the “get well soons” have worn a bit thin, even though of course we all want to extend sympathies and best wishes… My apologies for mentioning a thumb brake some time ago!.

As to the future of the club; I think the most important thing is this forum in more or less its present quaint form. Granted it could be easier to post pictures, although that’s not really a big deal. I do understand there are some deeper operating issues behind the curtains, which it would be really good to resolve without changing the forum superficially.

To this end I believe that part of the new management definitely needs to be a committed and competent IT person or persons, who can look after the forum.

Probably the most contentious issue is the required name change to comply with DOC.
I personally do not want to see the name changed. I like the name and I like the logo.

Neither do I see the point of staying with DOC, especially in the light of their dictations.
I only signed up with DOC to get a free T-shirt and I have no other interest beyond that. The advantages for us members is limited to some cheap freebies once a year which are out of date by the time they arrive and as mentioned by others, a few dollars off certain items and events offered by Ducati. There is always the option of joining a DOC club to gain these discounts if it means anything to you. I say leave DOC.

Maybe it would be possible to have a referendum on that issue alone. (I believe there is a poll facility on the forum?)

My concern with leaving DOC would be the funding for the forum, I’m not sure how that is done and whether or not leaving DOC would impact that. I don’t think we want a subscription? Although I probably wouldn’t object personally. As Rob mentions this would imply the need for a treasurer.

I’ve been the Norfolk rep for about 8 years I think and have been involved with a number of club events on a national scale. I love this club and my Monster. It would be great to be involved in running the club in some way, but in my case definitely as part of a team of enthusiasts not just the DOC designated officers, but all who would pitch in and help, maybe even with occasional physical committee meetings? Although we can do that online these days.
I’m not getting involved if DOC is… Just sayin’..

One little thing; Haven’t Grumpy and JP been VP in the time since 2010?

Here’s hoping for some meaningful discussion about this

[MrsC_772]

Hi Rob

Sorry to hear your recovery has not been straightforward.

Massive thanks to all you have done over the years for UKMOC (and Liz and Pedro).

For what it's worth, I think UKMOC should continue as UKMOC and ditch affiliation with Ducati as an official DOC. I don't think the benefits of affiliation are worth the ball-ache of dealing with Bologna (even speaking as one of the minority of members who has benefitted from discounted WDW tickets on 4 occasions and several Ducati factory/museum visits).

Over the years the emphasis from Ducati has been less on DOCs being factory supported clubs, more on factory directed/dictated clubs. It was bad enough having to change the font of the O in the UKMOC logo to comply with Bologna's rules, but to me having to change the club's name is a step too far.

The real value in UKMOC is the internet forum, with the collected experience and expertise of the members, particularly about Monster matters - brains to pick about technical issues, aftermarket parts & modifications. That, and the friendship and social events e.g. Weekenders. We need to find a way of keeping this aspect of UKMOC going (not involving Facebook).

If it's a question of the cost of keeping the forum hosted, other forums offer an opportunity to donate towards running costs (rather than having official "membership" with the need for a committee, treasurer etc). Could something like Patreon, Ko-fi etc be used if disaffiliation makes it harder to cover costs through banner advertising?.

I realise I have been a rubbish member the last couple of years (retreating into my own little off-internet world, since the bike forums reminded me too much of what I was missing during lockdown). I can see that while some of the long standing members are still stalwarts, there are newer Monsteristi who have risen to the challenge (Moco1961 taking on organising Weekenders in an exceptionally difficult period), which is fantastic to see.

Right now, I can't see myself ever owning another bike apart from my 696s, and I really hope that UKMOC as I know and love it will continue, but not as a DOC given the direction of travel.

[Jez900ie]

Slob, Pedro & Liz, thanks for all the many hours you have spent providing us with our UKMOC. You've done a great job!

[Luddite]

I'm sure I'm just expressing the feelings of all the members when I say how much your efforts (and those of Pedro and Liz) are appreciated. As you've already mentioned, this club is "one of the nicest corners of the internet..." (if proof were needed - http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/showthread.php?t=59601).

There's a real generosity of spirit here, which is lacking in most other forums, and I'd say a lot of that can be put down to your stewardship. Whoever takes over your position will have some very large Alpinestars to fill!

As Mr Gazza said, I think another attraction of the club is it's 'quaintness' and I'd be keen to keep that.

As to factory affiliation, I'm not particularly fussed either way but, if a name change is needed, why not keep the UKMOC initials and just change the 'O' from 'Owners' to, say, 'Obsessives'?

[Cousin it]

I can understand the decision you have made and as others have already said I am hugely appreciative of the efforts you have all made to make this the great place that it is.
good forums are more of a rarity in recient years as so many have moved to be Facebook based and lost all character.
I will follow and support whoever steps up to the mark.

[Dirty]

UKMOC

That's the name, end of.

[stopintime]

Donations works. At least in a place like this with plenty club feeling. No treasurer required if DOC is out - just a trusted leader.

The big step is to host pictures. It's not very expensive, but becomes expensive after a few years. Can be solved by downsizing or even deleting old pictures. Or: "Reach a limit, donate a pound"

Risky business, but it lifts forums a lot.

[alan s4]

Also like to pass on my thanks to Rob and the rest of the board, the UKMOC is a great club to be part of and this is due to the efforts of the team.

I would like to see the club remain independent and forum based as opposed to a homogenised/sanitised version that Audi/Ducati approve of.

[slob]

I'll try and answer everything that's been raised so far, let me know if you feel I've missed anything, sorry my mind is so chaotic:

Lars(stopintime) makes a good point about the DOC affiliation. I feel it probably mostly works very well for Italian clubs, where small regional clubs are tied to their local dealer, less well for the rest of the World, especially in the UK where we have national clubs that predate any factory affilation.
For example I received an email notification of the #werideasone initiative, which was meant to get as many DOC members as possible down to their local dealer for a 'global rideout', 48 hours before the event was due to take place, hardly enough time to get anyone anywhere! presumably because I'm not a Facebook user?
However I'm aware that we have quite a few members who are not active on the forum but love to go to WDW and really look forward to any annual offical trinkets.

I'll also take this opportunity to point out that we've never restricted forum access to UK Monster Owners, the contribution of stopintime and many others makes this forum a richer place, even if he's not technically a UKMOC member. The same goes for pillion passengers, I know I wouldn't be without mine! When members have sold their Monsters, I've always said I'd give them a year's grace with DOC affiliation, it's amazing how often owners regret the sale and come back with another Monster shortly afterwards.

Also, tied to the myDucati website is a DOC management platform, which allows management of affiliation/memberships etc. and has a handy mailout tool for communication with members but has never been open to anyone but the Presidents, making a mockery of the VP and Secretary roles as defined by DMH.
I am on a global whatsapp group of DOC presidents and this is a regular gripe recently, but is as nothing to the name change thing, it's a real pain for most clubs, most of whom have paid memberships and are effectively companies with trademarks financial requirements.
Will our fellow DOC: Ducati Owners Club GB, just be know as 'GB' from now on (after nearly 40 years!).
The Scottish club dropped affilation earlier this year, they were the only other free to join DOC in the UK.
I figured we were better working with DMH than independently, although I feel the nature of the relationship has been declining since 2012. We'd always had a very good relationship with DUK although I haven't met the new CEO since Tim left.
As I said in the OP I don't feel it's my place to make the call on how 'we' go forward as a club, as I walk out of the door, but I know what my gut feeling is right now!

I agree with Lars and MrsC about Facebook being totally unsuitable for running a club, certainly things like technical info would disappear into 'digital soup' and never be findable again. Never mind about my general feelings about Facebook, I can't believe anyone would still want to be on there in light of the revelations in the last few years, no matter how convenient it is. Its mission is to replace every forum and other means of communication and silo off its slice of the Internet for the enrichment of Mr Suka-burg but for ease of use, Facebook is more or less the benchmark for whatever forum software a club uses I'm afraid.

I've always tried to keep the forum free, as it was when I joined in 2003, this has meant Pedro and I do the forum support and our hosting provider (another former member) takes care of the Server itself. It also had the bonus of meaning we didn't go the same way as at least three clubs I can think of, that imploded due to financial 'irregularities'.
This also presents a potential pitfall for a subscription/donation model, as soon as payment is involved complete financial openness is an absolute must have.

cont...

[slob]

...

I bought some alternate forum software (the same as that other channel that most of you are well aware of), stuck it on AWS and have tried migrating this forum's data to it a couple of times with varying degrees of success, in order to solve the broken picture upload issue that bugs the current forum as well as a few other issues, however repeated requests for anyone with relevant computer skills to share the admin burden have been met with no response whatsoever and tying myself to supporting a new system with little or no help was always a non-starter for me, especially as I quit two decades of working in IT because it was starting to make me very miserable indeed. I've also been very preoccupied with my recovery, which has to take precedence for me.
Lars is also right that over the years hosting photos has the potential to become an out of control expense, again I don't think that should be my call right now.

Yes Gary, we can set up polls for anything you like.

I inherited a small building society account from benson (who was joint President with Pedro before me) however this was almost useless, with no chequebook and no facility for internet banking, leading me to use my own bank account for money in/out. This is essentially just hosting costs plus the odd sundry expense. The building society has since stopped doing free club/charity accounts and I 'just' need to fill in the ridiculous international money laundering forms to get the balance out. It's spare change FFS. I am piecing together all the receipts etc. to work out which way the balance is owing, to me or the club. I will make the 'books' available and hand over any balance when I go.
I'll also hand over any freebies I've received from Ducati at WPMs etc, that I'm sitting on for when someone needs weekender raffle prizes etc. These tend to be end of line merchandise items that are left over when this year's stuff comes out.

I didn't specifically list others who have served as regional reps, weekender organisers and on the 'board', as I figured accidentally missing someone off might be more offensive than not naming everyone personally. They know who they are and are well aware that the more you put into the club, the more you get out!

Since my decision to stick with the DOC thing, we've been restricted to who we can advertise (DMH won't allow DOCs to advertise unoffical dealers or services they see as direct competition) so our hosting for 2022 is tied to DUK advertising. This means the club needs the three board members, at least to the end of the year, after that the club could return to whatever the collective membership wants. Otherwise the residual advertising money might need paying back and I'll just switch off the lights on my way out, frankly I'd have felt better about dying on a roadside near Aylesbury than doing that.

The many messages of support and sympathy I've received here and by email are heartwarming, it's not what this post is about. My previous attempts to stand down (2015 and 2017 IIRC) have invariably been met with 'you're doing a grand job, carry on', which I don't think has been good for the club in the long run. I have been progressively running out of momentum to take the UKMOC forward even before my accident. A club of mostly middle aged men, who are dying off with frightening regularity won't have a great future.
Despite the 'trellis purists', we need to welcome ALL Monster owners. I'm genuinely upset that I didn't get to test ride the latest generation of bikes, apparenty they're an absolute hoot. People almost always tend to resist change to some degree, get over it!

I also need to talk to DMH/DUK and find out what the process is for replacing the board members from their point of view, since I'm the one who signed the 2022 regs etc. ...assuming I'm not forced to take the 'nuclear option'.

Rob
--

[Stinger101]

It makes a sad read Rob. Feels like the end of an era. You were there when I joined and became a friend of mine. That won't change for sure!
I love this little club and the forum, the get togethers' weekenders' etc. It's a really cool atmosphere. I don't give a chuff about any DOC affiliation or corporate BS. I would like to keep things 'here' between us all as it is now. Being in Warwickshire, there's very little UKMOC activity, that should change and Tracey & I don't mind looking at organising local club meets/rideouts etc if called upon.

Take care my friend, and hopefully catch you somewhere, sometime.

[Pedro]

My thoughts for what they’re worth…

Definitely need new leadership, the current team have been in post way too long and whilst I’ve got a lot out of the club over the years, I just don’t have the time now to put my heart and soul into it as much as it needs.

The whole name change thing is bloody ridiculous imho, we’re the UKMOC and should stay that way even if it means ditching the links to the factory. The returns for blindly following their demands aren’t worth the effort and the club identity is worth more. As far as revenue is concerned to run this show, then ditching DMH opens up the option for all the decent independent workshops to advertise, many of whom the members already use, especially with the older generation of bikes.

I’ve spoke to Rob recently and fully understand and support his position, especially when dealing with the aftermath of his crash and the lingering issues he’s dealing with. As has been said, the more you put in the more you get out so we need someone to step up and keep this great club alive and kicking in the future.

I still have my two monsters and will always be grateful for the club in terms of technical help but more so for the friends I’ve made on here, it really is valuable asset to many and so deserves to continue without DMH dictating how we run things in return for some cheap freebies.

Ped
Soon to be ex-VP

[slob]

tick tock, tick tock …

[Albie]

I hope all goes well. I'm glad to be keeping the UKMOC name if we can. Im not fussed anymore about corporate just like a friendly forum with a good stream of knowledge. What I have learnt over the last 19 years has been most helpful and that's what is the club needs to keep. What I would like though is the slight upgrade of the threads usefulness in maybe having just a like button rather than having to write a 10 letter comment. Obviously that old picture thing but I cope with that.
Is there any candidates out there. Have we also still got county reps covered.
I'm definately not standing not that I would win but I see plenty of good people on here done fine jobs over the last few years can have my vote .

[Mr Gazza]

Thanks for the update Rob , and clearing one or two things up.

I think I now understand how the DOC affiliation effects the way advertising is sold for the forum. Obviously they would only want the company's interests promoted.
You say that leaving DOC would open the options to seek advertising from independents and so forth, I wonder if DUK and authorised dealers would be prohibited by Ducati from sponsoring the forum after we left? The situation with Moto Rapido might change too as far as UKMOC was concerned regarding discount and their ability to advertise on the forum?
(They are and would remain my favourite dealer anyway.)
Would you be prepared to say on here how much the forum costs to run per annum?

There does seem to be overwhelming support for leaving DOC at the moment and I think that is what is going to happen. Even so it would seem that we need at least a caretaker committee of the DOC required officers until the current affiliation expires.
I for one would not want to stand for President under their guidelines (or rules?) Particularly the one about the President having legal responsibility.. That's just way too heavy! Clubs usually protect themselves from that sort of bs with larger committees, insurance and legal advice paid for from subscriptions.

Is there a date of expiry for the current affiliation?

Looking beyond DOC.
The way I see it, we need an officer to ensure that the forum is sponsored from advertising.
An officer who is capable of maintaining the IT aspect of the forum to ensure it runs at least as well as it does currently.
A figurehead for the club, but not necessarily called President nor necessarily regarded as in charge of anything, just making sure that everything is running smoothly and calling elections for new officers when they are due.
I'm sure a new constitution will soon evolve with as easy going a feel that reflects the way UKMOC already feels.

[Pedro]

Gazza

You need someone with some authority, in the distant past we’ve had to sort out spats between members, step in when members felt victimised and remove a few people all together for being tw*ts and looking to start trouble all the time. Not a pleasant side but necessary all the same.

As for the MR discount, that’s more Wilf and his team being supportive and the relationship they had with Terry (Fatbloke and forum founder), continuing through me and to Rob. I very much doubt DMH either know or care about the discount they kindly provide.

It’s disappointing to see a lack of people offering to step up unless Rob knows more than I, many are happy to benefit from this forum but it seems they’ve unwilling to put anything back in.

Rob - perhaps a new thread specifically for volunteers/nominations may prompt so action?

Ped

[Nasher]

Gazza

It’s disappointing to see a lack of people offering to step up unless Rob knows more than I, many are happy to benefit from this forum but it seems they’ve unwilling to put anything back in.


I think that's a little harsh.

I speak from experience of running events for boat clubs and a pre-internet owners club.

Everyone on here really appreciates the work that's put in by the team, and because of that realises exactly how much time and effort goes into it. And how hard it can be at times.

That in turn means that nearly everyone who would like to be able to step up worries or knows they just don't have enough time and possibly the ability to do the role justice like you guys.

I'd love to have a crack at it, but when family, work, and other commitments have to take priority I wouldn't feel I was giving the club my best or full commitment, so am just not prepared to let everyone down. I'm sure many feel that way and admire you guys commitment more because of it.
In a few years when I'm properly retired I'd possibly consider it, but then probably wouldn't be of the correct age or demographic to take the club forward.

What's needed is a team who are able to reliably commit the time, energy, and enthusiasm to do the roles justice on a regular basis.
You guys have been great at it, but in reality your posts in this thread have actually just proved how hard it is to maintain around normal life.

Oh, and sod DMH and their affiliation rules, it appears like too much grief with too little benefit. Of course MR will continue to give discount to members whatever the situation.

[Moco1961]

Totally agree Nasher, having tackled the weekenders recently I know what commitment looks like so really appreciate the team for the hard work they do all year round ,work ,family and life in general will get in the way meaning full commitment is not possible for many…… and I fear I am already the wrong demographic :chuckle:.

A team that can share out the burden is required, without the constraints and dictates of the increasingly corporate DMH, we are an owners club by definition so we stay UKMOC in my opinion and wave goodbye to affiliation. What have the Romans ever done for us…..Wsb meet and greet at Donington…….discount entry into the museum……support with some freebies and raffle prizes at the 2019 weekender…….annual membership pack…….but apart from these :mand:

This is a great place to be and long May it remain so, I am with Gazza, the free and easy feel is the way to go, the T & C ,s for the current positions are way too heavy.

I am more than happy to be part of a new era Pedro,(indeed I have already spoken with Rob and picked up the baton once more for a Weekender next year) but as an independent UKMOC .

:ukm:

[Pedro]

Nasher & Moco

My post was intended to spur a reaction not to criticise, I’m well aware of the time needed but as they say, a job shared is a job halved, spreading the load between more people will make it much easier

Ped

[slob]

Not really harsh, very blunt maybe. However this is the reason we decided we had to stand down en-masse, otherwise anyone remaining in post will continue to be tied to the forum indefinitely. As I said earlier, we’ve tried to step down before and are invariably met with no further candidates to be part of this team and a ‘carry on you’re doing a great job’, even though I don’t think we were. Liz stepped up to provide the third required person, when JP sold his Monster and started a family, despite being heavily tied to running a (successful) Classic TT team, serving on the Calne Bike Meet commitee, her job and her family commitments.

Yes, running a weekender is a huge task to take on… which is why Pedro and I (and the club founder, fatbloke, before us) never got involved in the nuts and bolts of running them… but always one with an end in sight, the club/forum would go on, with or without a weekender. Part of this is an endictment of my poor leadership skills (You see, I haven’t been doing such a great job after all, have I) having allowed us to get to this place at all, it was very nearly precipitated three years ago but for my reasonable level of fitness, an Arai RX7 and a Dainese back protector!

To focus on immediate issues: FWIW I agree about the name change and splitting with DMH and their ill conceived edict but assuming a team of three can be found to stand ‘til end of December that can wait and is just serving as a distraction. I listed it in the interests of full disclosure, so potential candidates wouldn’t feel ambushed. Then from January the team/commitee can be whatever size and shape it decides on.

With this in mind I strongly suggest any potential candidates contact me secretly to avoid becoming ‘the default position’ for everyone else. Otherwise the clock is still ticking like an allegory for global warming…

[slob]

Thanks for the update Rob , and clearing one or two things up.

I think I now understand how the DOC affiliation effects the way advertising is sold for the forum. Obviously they would only want the company's interests promoted.
You say that leaving DOC would open the options to seek advertising from independents and so forth, I wonder if DUK and authorised dealers would be prohibited by Ducati from sponsoring the forum after we left? The situation with Moto Rapido might change too as far as UKMOC was concerned regarding discount and their ability to advertise on the forum?
(They are and would remain my favourite dealer anyway.)
Would you be prepared to say on here how much the forum costs to run per annum?

Currently we pay under £600/year for hosting.

As I've already said: Pedro and I have taken care of all the forum support since 2007, so no costs there although that might change depending on who takes over. We have a few other ancilliary costs such as domain name registration which so far has been taken care of through small profits over the years on t-shirts, stickers and slight overpayment of postage for the DOC trinkets (I just rounded up to make sure I wasn't going to money to people who don't understand paypal fees, many people overpay a bit to support the forum anyway) As I said earlier, I'm piecing together all the receipts still.


There does seem to be overwhelming support for leaving DOC at the moment and I think that is what is going to happen. Even so it would seem that we need at least a caretaker committee of the DOC required officers until the current affiliation expires.
I for one would not want to stand for President under their guidelines (or rules?) Particularly the one about the President having legal responsibility.. That's just way too heavy! Clubs usually protect themselves from that sort of bs with larger committees, insurance and legal advice paid for from subscriptions.

Is there a date of expiry for the current affiliation?

Ducati UK is a direct subsiduary of Ducati Motor Holding, so yes! and we're currently tied to that until 23:59 31/12/22. I thought I'd made the need for a caretaker committee abundantly clear in the OP? All the bureaucracy makes no legal difference, the CEO is sill responsible under Italian law, remember Frank Williams going to court over Ayrton Senna's death at Monza?

cont ...

[slob]

...


Looking beyond DOC.
The way I see it, we need an officer to ensure that the forum is sponsored from advertising.
An officer who is capable of maintaining the IT aspect of the forum to ensure it runs at least as well as it does currently.
A figurehead for the club, but not necessarily called President nor necessarily regarded as in charge of anything, just making sure that everything is running smoothly and calling elections for new officers when they are due.
I'm sure a new constitution will soon evolve with as easy going a feel that reflects the way UKMOC already feels.

We’ve so far avoided excessive formality in favour of a kind of benevolent autocracy, along with (mostly) light touch moderation, to keep the forum friendly and conflict free. Remember the forum started as two guys running an email list until it got too big to manage that way, Can you imagine trying to email your Norfolk group if you had over a hundred people on it?
I've tried hard to 'keep things the way they were', clearly that's now backfiring. I could never have managed commitees, written constitutions, big finance etc. and feel they'll be the death of the easy-going club and forum anyway.

I think you'd want at least 2 IT people going forward, in case something untoward happened to one of them.

The other downside of not keeping it all free is that as soon as annual turnover hits £2000, you need to register as a charity with HMRC etc etc.
Bear in mind that other forums might be a big commercial IT hosting company posing as several little bike forums, you'll find an implausibly similar but 'skinned' format for other makes and models? You pay up or you see an awful lot of inline advertising!

Good luck calling elections... I've lost well two hours to this thread already this morning but not seen any interest in taking the reigns from anyone :-(

[stopintime]

Can you point at two(three?) people and tell them they've just been elected? I've done that a few times and to my surprise it works.

[slob]

I could try but I won't.
I can however turn out the lights on my way out, the power to prevent that is in everyone elses hands.
Tick tock, tick tock...

[Nasher]

It goes without saying really that those who are interested, and/or concerned, enough about it to reply to this thread are possibly the ones who should be volunteering
.
.
.
.
Bugger.

[Darren69]

Well all 3 or my potential suggested members have already indicated that they don't want to or can't fill the position. There are a couple of others who I would suggest but will have to see if there is willing?

[Pedro]

Once the split from DMH takes place, running this show will be much more straightforward, it essentially boils down to keeping the forum alive and moderating new members (which I do daily on the whole). Perhaps a little cajoling of area reps as well and maybe, if it suits, organising a few things like a little paid advertising to help with costs - if as Rob says forum hosting is around £6-700 plus a few other costs then selling some advert space to half a dozen independants should be pretty easy once a year. Everyone know UKMOC in the trade so it's a cheap source of business for a very modest outlay.

That being said, what the UKMOC really needs is fresh hands at the top, not necessarily to reinvent the club but to guide it and preserve the "nice corner of the internet" it has become. It's an absolute mine of useful info, be a shame to lose that.

Nasher - to your point, you may well have hit the nail on the head, the regular posters on here are quite few in number but they are also the passionate ones who love both the bikes and the UKMOC!! If you want to chat about what I've done club wise in the past and how much time is sucks up, give me a call if you like

Ped

[Darren69]

there really is no forum without those who regularly post on here, the key members, so if they don't want or are unwilling to steer the forum then there will be no forum moving forward. Yes there are a few new members here and there but it is still a core of half a dozen or so who keep this thing alive, if they don't want to step up and keep it going then unfortunately it will die.

[slob]

I’ve said this before:

The Forum is the Club, the Club is the Forum.


*with apologies for misquoting Frank Herbert

[Grumpy]

I've deliberately refrained from commenting, until now, as I felt the dust needed to settle from Rob etc deciding to resign.

Reading through the details, in the various comments, it strikes me there are several options/ direction the club/forum could go.

Stay with DOC, allowing the core of the club to be changed over time by the dictates of Italy.
Resign from DOC at the end of the year, therefore allowing UKMOC and any signatures to any legal documents the ability to move away from DOC without reprocessions.
These two would require a new ( larger)team to run the club/forum, steering UKMOC into the future.

Close the doors and switch the lights out.
I'm not in favour of this option.

Personally, the set up requires a complete restructuring across the board for UKMOC to move forward, which would allow the first two options to be viable.

Moving away from DOC makes most sense. I've always thought Bologna, over a period of time, would want more control over any affiliated club.The

I think we have time to come up with a viable plan, rather than make a hasty decision.

[Dave G]

Cut ties with DOC. I can see no benefit from the connection other than the one the DOC would gain over this loose collection of enthusiasts
I’ve been a quite member of UKMOC for a long time, I would hate to see it go, though have not the time or skills to help.
I’ve seen friendly club spirit disappear in other places with these reorganisations with misguided attempts to ‘organise’, any suggestion of facebook involvement would be the death of this place too.

[slob]

Again I think the name change thing is a distraction, the Italians might even backtrack before the end of the year. Although ‘seat of the pants’ polling says the opinion is overwhelmingly divorce is imminent.

[slob]

tick, tick, tick …

[Liz]

I’d like to say a big thank you to Slob and Pedro for all their hard work running the club over the years. Also to all the regional reps and those who have organised Weekenders!

I’d like to see the club stay as the UKMOC as that’s what and who we are. I’ve got a lot of pins and wrist bands which are from our affiliation but they’re just sitting in an envelope and I’m sure I won’t miss receiving any more (apart from all the hassle it is for Slob to send them all out) and I know it’s more involved than just the change of name.

I thought about selling my S2R and bought a KTM 790 Duke (which will be up for sale soon if anyone wants one!), but the old girl has had a full service and been back out and about and I remember why I fell in love with it in the first place!

I hope you have had time to read Slob’s post fully and new folks will consider stepping forward to take the reins. I’m happy to stay as Wiltshire rep and let’s hope now we are starting to get some normality back in the world that we can get out and about a bit more.

:ukm:

[slob]

We have some future shape for the club forming. If anyone else is interested in taking up the reins, now would be the time to step forward. Let me know privately if you don't want to post on this thread.

[rollo22]

Hi Slob

Any news.
It seems to have gone a bit quiet on the leadership hunt with the end of July fast approaching as the dead line.
It would be nice to know if any body is taking over the club presidency and the officers positions

[slob]

Yes, it looks like we have a solution and probably a slightly longer handover

[Jez900ie]

Yes, it looks like we have a solution and probably a slightly longer handover

https://i.postimg.cc/dVG7gbxQ/good.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[DaveR]

Wow, you don't visit the forum for a few days and all hell breaks loose.
Firstly I'd like to say thank you to Rob, Pedro and Liz for all the hard work that they have done behind the scenes to keep this club the great place it has been. The club has really hit the spot for me and made the owning and riding or my Monster much more enjoyable.
From my point of view I think we need to cut the ties with the factory and keep the UKMOC name. I have found the offerings underwhelming a d don't believe that they have any real interest in the older bikes or those who want to keep them going.
The hardest challenge facing the club will be how to attract new younger members to keep it going, yes we need to welcome the new models and owners, but how?
Unfortunately I have neither the IT skills or time at present to help, but I am willing to support those who have to move the club forward in the coming years.

Dave

[slob]

I'm pleased to announce the proposed new committee taking over at the end of the year will be:

President: Grumpy
VP: Moco1961
Secretary Adie851

[Mr Gazza]

What a stout band of men.
We'll be in good hands.. :D

[rollo22]

That’s taken it’s time to be revealed.
Congratulations to the new 3 wise men.

[stopintime]

T H A N K Y O U, new and old heroes!

[MrsC_772]

Thank you to Grumpy, Moco1961 and Adie851 for volunteering. Experience of running Weekenders, meets and other Monster days out will stand them in good stead.

[dacs]

Holy trinities, Batman :mand:
Seriously guys, thanks for stepping up and saving the Forum, I promise not to cause you any grief (even Grumpy)

[Albie]

Well done for taking it on. Applause from me.

✋✋

[Bitza]

Thank you one and all, if people like them don't take on such responsibilities the rest of us can't enjoy being part of such a community. So again thank you!

[Jez900ie]

Very good news!

[yellowfever]

Many thanks to the old team for all their excellent work for the club over the years and big thanks to the new ones for stepping up and volunteering to keep this great club running.

Good luck to all

[Christy]

Good news. Thanks to all for your comitment :hail:

[Stinger101]

This is good news indeed!

[bigredduke]

Result!
Sincere thanks to the three of you for taking on the jobs.

[350TSS]

^^^^^ Agreed