796 Corse starting difficulty

[Motorcycle Mick]

Hi
I have had my 2011 796 for 15 months and I am enjoying the experience,but I have experienced occasional reluctance to start,with the starter sounding asthmatic,sometimes turning ignition off and on will resuscitate ,this has often been after a lengthy ride (50+ miles) I keep the bike coupled to an Optimate while it is garaged , yesterday however it progressed,I had been for a 100 mile trip in the morning,with no problems,I went to work,left the bike parked for just over 2 hours when I turned the key the dash went through the normal sequence but the starter just engaged but would not turn the engine over , I had the bike recovered and plugged in the Optimate overnight , this morning I disconnected the Optimate and checked the voltage at the charge socket,12.9 volts,tried the starter and it turned over very smartly,I left the charger off went shopping,on my return I rechecked - voltage still 12.9 starter turned over smartly again,does this sound familiar to anyone,any idea what I could check.?:dizzy:

[Mr Gazza]

It could be one or both of two things.

First, the battery could be 10 years old and past its best? But I suspect not if it charges to nearly 13Volts and spins the motor over okay.
However you can put a meter on it when you crank it over and see what the voltage goes down to when the starter is engaged. It might dip to 11 volts and then recover quickly to nearer 13 or more.
If the battery voltage drops a lot and does not recover to very near the original voltage after starting and then stopping. it could well be that it has lost it's lost it's "cranking amps" and needs replacing.

The second thing will be the charging system. (More likely from what you've said.) To test if it is charging, keep the meter plugged in, (To your optimate lead if you can't access the battery with it running.) with the engine now running. it should show the charging current, which should be in excess of 13 volts, preferably 14-14.5 volts, but anything over 15 volts is bad news.
This may rise a little when revs increase, but still not over 15V.

If you are not getting a charging current when running, then there will be a problem with the Rectifier, the alternator and/or the cabling and connections between them.

Narrow it down to the battery or the charging and report back.. :biggrin:

[Ron1000]

+1 what mr gazza said.

Also i had reluctant start issues with my 1100 evo. Not battery or charging system related.

With help from here the general consensus was that the starter motor is a bit weak for the engine. And every help it can get is best. I literally sprayed (continue to spray 1 to 2 times per year) acf50 directly on to the starter motor terminal under the rubber boot.

All my issues have been solved and it starts no problems.

Note: do not be tempted to take that nut off on the starter cable that will lead to starter motor catastrophic failure.

[Motorcycle Mick]

Thanks for the pointers , I’ll try them tomorrow and report results :eyepopping::dizzy:

[Darren69]

+1 charging issue. Isn't there a volt meter function on the dash on those models?

[Motorcycle Mick]

I put the bike on my Optimate 4 charger overnight this morning voltage was 13.2 ,started the engine voltage was 14.6 at tickover,left for 15 minutes,12.9 v down to 12.2 with ignition on,dropped to 10.9 while cranking returned to 14.6 at tickover
I wonder if I should replace the battery as I don’t know it’s history although I am reluctant to waste money and the aggravation of changing it
Any other checks?

[Motorcycle Mick]

Dash is minimal just a charge light

[Darren69]

I'd check the battery again in a day or 2 without being on charge. Otherwise it would seem to be ok.

[Mr Gazza]

On face value those figures don't show anything of particular concern.
Your charging system seems to be in good health, unless the voltage rises above 15V when you increase the revs.

The battery will show a high voltage straight off charge and will loose the top off that fairly quickly anyway, so I would say 12.9-12.2V would not be a big worry, but try leaving it overnight without charging and test in the morning to see if it's held up.

Either the battery won't hold a charge any longer, or you have something draining it somewhere? I don't know if it's normal for the voltage to drop by 0.7 of a Volt with just the ignition on? But it doesn't sound unreasonable.

If the battery does loose it's charge overnight in the bike, then I guess the test for a current drain would be to see if it still drops disconnected. If it does then it's definitely the battery. If not then you will have some fun finding what's draining it!

For what it's worth I think (personally) that those optimate thingies kill batteries, I've never used one myself but rather fitted a Motobatt. It's been on there 9 years now with no attention whatsoever.

[Luddite]

Dash is minimal just a charge light

To access the voltmeter just push the mode switch forward:

https://i.postimg.cc/fWtjLkzR/Screenshot-20211010-132839-2.png (https://postimages.org/)

https://i.postimg.cc/prFD1cGF/Screenshot-20211010-132812-2.png (https://postimages.org/)

Your battery figures sound similar to my 1100 Evo, which is a healthy Motobatt. It may be, as Ron alluded to, some corrosion on the starter cable connectors (usually at the starter motor end as that's the one that's exposed to the elements). The cable is marginal at the best of times and any corrosion increases the resistance and can just tip the starter circuit over the edge. Have a look under the rubber boot to see if there's any obvious signs of corrosion.

[Motorcycle Mick]

As the man says “read the f.......g book”!
Reads 12.2 on batt volts

[Motorcycle Mick]

In my defence when it failed to start the dash display was flashing and I didn’t realise that I could interrogated it for information

[slob]

new plugs and a TPS reset

[Motorcycle Mick]

Sorry to be thick,but TPS ??

[Luddite]

TPS = Throttle Position Sensor.

You can reset it yourself by following these instructions:

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/showpost.php?p=542255&postcount=4

[Motorcycle Mick]

Latest update
Left bike off charge overnight 0930 checked 12.8 v on multimeter,12.1 on dash display,tried to start ,starter engaged,turned the engine about half a turn and cut out,dash display went all haywire ,numbers flashing but no turn,released the starter ,switched off and on the dash reset,pressed the start button again ,same result,reset it again dash indicated 12.1 v pushed the start button ,and low and behold it turned over and started,indicating 14 v at tickover....wtf??

[Mr Gazza]

It sounds to me like the battery has broken down inside and playing games with you, but it could also indicate a bad connection somewhere, maybe an earth, or the main lead down to the starter.
I would have the battery out and take it to a garage where they can do some comprehensive checks on it, then renew with a Motobatt if it's faulty.

It's always good to have a look at connections anyway, so no harm in checking the battery connections are nice and firm and clean. Also where the main earth connects to the engine and/or frame. Take the connection apart and make sure that clean bright metal is in contact with clean bright metal. Same with the starter pole, but make very sure that that the threaded post does not turn when you loosen or tighten the nut there may be a square on the end of it that you can hold whilst you turn the nut? If the post turns it will rip out wires connected within and then require a strip to repair! So be careful.

It could also be your solenoid or starter relay playing up. You can bypass those with a jump lead from battery positive to starter pole to see if you get a good starter spin.

[Dukedesmo]

Agree with Mr Gazza, sounds like a battery on it's way out.

I've got a single-cylinder ride-on mower, recently suffered similar - plenty of voltage in the battery but not enough current to turn the starter, new battery solved the problem.

That said my Monster never sounds like it's going to start even with a fully charged battery. Push the starter and it will often 'wait' until it's ready before turning the engine - I assume it's just easing a piston over the compression before getting any momentum?

[Luddite]

[QUOTE=Motorcycle Mick;590198]...dash display went all haywire.../QUOTE]

What exactly happened with the dash? Did the trip and clock reset themselves? Did the dash itself go blank? Did you briefly see a message like "0005 rSW" before the dash shut off? If so, then the dash detected a low voltage and shut itself down to avoid any damage.

That could be caused by either a weak battery or a failing connection in the starting circuit. (It could be something as simple as a loose battery lead.)

Also, check the starter relay. I had a starting problem caused by the relay working itself loose from its housing. Make sure it's pressed fully home and I suggest you also loop a cable tie over the relay so it can't pop out during normal running. It lives on the right side of the battery box (the relay is no. 15 on the first diagram and the battery box is no. 6 on the second).

https://i.postimg.cc/1tJ113f0/photostudio-1617372204122.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://i.postimg.cc/Y9pBPWqq/photostudio-1617372266807.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Ron1000]

Yep battery replacement is first port of call.

I recommend jmp LiFePo types 😜

[crawsue]

It’s a very similar issue to one I had on a 696, the battery being inaccessible it was the last place I looked.....turned out to be loose battery cable connections. My local “guru” put his meter on the Accumate lead and got strange results, he called the connections....he was right!