illegal cans

[Macman900]

Hi all, not been on for a while due to other aspects of life getting in the way etc. Was out today (bank holiday Monday) in Matlock. Got pulled by a very high profile Police operation which was taking place near the 'Whatstandwell' lay-by. I got a fine for illegal exhausts.

They'd positioned Police bikes at the Hurt Arms pub on the junction, if anyones knows it and along side the petrol station just as you come out of Matlock towards the A38. A fair stretch of road to cover between the two points. This was at 10am so by the end of the day they'll have copped a fair few.

There were plenty of bikes being pulled in by Police marked cars which seemed to be absolutely everywhere. I was told local residents had had enough of the noise and this operation was the result. I was also told it is being extended to other areas and that the intolerance to illegal and noise exhausts will increase throughout the year. Make of that what you will.

I hold my hand up and am not complaining. I'm a fairly low-key sort of bloke and rider and don't ride aggressive or loud if that makes sense. Have had the Termi's on the bike for as long as I've owned it (18 years) so to get a fine now sucks but 'hey...it was a good run'. They're not E-marked, which is the only thing the Police would accept in my case. Actually they are marked "Not for road use" it was just that he couldn't find it and deemed it an open or "race" system which made me subject to a fine. I wasn't going to argue! There were at least 10 bikes in for inspection while I was being dealt with, at least 3 Harleys, a GPZ900R and a Bandit 1200 from what I could see. A newer 750 Monster was being pulled in as I left. Was that any of you?

So now I've got to find the cash to buy legal, E-stamped cans so I don't miss out on this years riding and pay the fine. So any suggestions for E-stamped, road legal, carbon cans which won't kill the power, sound (too much) would be appreciated, or is that asking too much. I've never had any points on my license (ok, so I'm a slow rider, I don't care) so I apologise for what may read like war and peace but I needed a place to vent off so to speak...and this is it! Oh...and it'll probably end up in the wrong section.

[jonzi]

How much was the fine?

the police won't be able to keep up pulling people all the time.

If you've been "caught" once in 18 years, pay the fine and keep the cans you have now?

Or buy a stamp and stamp them your self?

[Dirty]

How much was the fine?

the police won't be able to keep up pulling people all the time.

If you've been "caught" once in 18 years, pay the fine and keep the cans you have now?

Or buy a stamp and stamp them your self?

What he said. How much is the fine? Then how much divided by 18 :chuckle:

https://youtu.be/GMc9q29IB_4

[pompone]

How much was the fine?

the police won't be able to keep up pulling people all the time.

If you've been "caught" once in 18 years, pay the fine and keep the cans you have now?

Or buy a stamp and stamp them your self?

Jonzi you're in the clear anyway as all my cans are E stamped :D

[squarehead]

My Arrows came with lovely European certification. I hope that's good enough 'cos my S2R is noisy as feck. Is there going to be a rash of Termi's for sale?

Good job they're cheap! :mand:

[Yorkie]

They do these 'clamp down safety days' at Helmsley and Squires Milkbar/pub/ biker meet at least twice a year. I just avoid all the usual biker haunts.

Yorkie

[Macman900]

Not sure what the fine will be, I did ask but he got distracted by another cop dealing with what sounded like an arguing Harley rider. After that the cop sent me on my way as he needed the coned off slot for his next customer.

[Macman900]

Not selling the Termi's, I'll try to modify/fix etc and maybe stamp them myself somehow.

[bluestoesonnose]

Had my can bodies laser engraved ages ago.....

[Yorkie]

You could use these and have them tacked on to the cans:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycle-Exhaust-BSAU-Marked-Plate-57mm-304-S-S-Motorbike-Road-Legal-Stamp/371260639549?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3D2f5391fee2ea41849e6 a2002c9a55470%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26 sd%3D121636688641&rt=nc

Yorkie

[Dirty]

You could use these and have them tacked on to the cans:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycle-Exhaust-BSAU-Marked-Plate-57mm-304-S-S-Motorbike-Road-Legal-Stamp/371260639549?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3D2f5391fee2ea41849e6 a2002c9a55470%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26 sd%3D121636688641&rt=nc

Yorkie

Hmmm, can you weld SS to Ti?

[Flip]

Hmmm, can you weld SS to Ti?

If you get caught by the Feds in a clamp down you're fecked with those pipes- I've heard them!! :cry:

I wonder if arguing my clutch is louder than my race cans would work? It's what my MoT tester laughs at while he passes it.

My Ferracci cans were fitted before the bike even left the dealers when it was new and have been on ever since- the originals are in their boxes in my loft- it seems a shame to use them after all this time.

What about these:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/METALLIC-E-MARKED-EXHAUST-STICKER-/201322484817?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2edfc15451

[Dirty]

If you get caught by the Feds in a clamp down you're fecked with those pipes- I've heard them!! :cry:

I wonder if arguing my clutch is louder than my race cans would work? It's what my MoT tester laughs at while he passes it.

My Ferracci cans were fitted before the bike even left the dealers when it was new and have been on ever since- the originals are in their boxes in my loft- it seems a shame to use them after all this time.

What about these:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/METALLIC-E-MARKED-EXHAUST-STICKER-/201322484817?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2edfc15451


Ha ha yeah probably but worth a punt anyway, also spotted these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/E1-BSAU-sticker-decal-MOT-EXHAUST-TAG-CAN-STAMP-MARKING-PLATE-ROAD-LEGAL-BSAU/121636688641?_trksid=p2047675.c100009.m1982&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D20140328180637%26meid%3Dd42cab58eca746a4933 acdc7aa232aa9%26pid%3D100009%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D10%2 6sd%3D371260639549


Hoping to get a dry clutch too soon so maybe that will help distract! :chuckle:

[Darren69]

Ha ha yeah probably but worth a punt anyway, also spotted these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/E1-BSAU-sticker-decal-MOT-EXHAUST-TAG-CAN-STAMP-MARKING-PLATE-ROAD-LEGAL-BSAU/121636688641?_trksid=p2047675.c100009.m1982&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D20140328180637%26meid%3Dd42cab58eca746a4933 acdc7aa232aa9%26pid%3D100009%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D10%2 6sd%3D371260639549


Hoping to get a dry clutch too soon so maybe that will help distract! :chuckle:

Those look pretty good for sticking to carbon cans!

Did they have dB meters to pull you or was it just at their judgment?

[Mr Gazza]

I can almost picture the scene inside the village hall. The Matlock parish council have invited the Cheif Constable to a public meeting to just about jolly well see what what can done about all these horrid noisey bikers.

I get the impression that they are not too keen on Bikes in that area. Whilst passing through, I have been sliced up by fist waving drivers for no reason and was once refused to be served in a Pub a bit outside Matlock, when we walked down from our camp site in our bike gear??

I have a unique view of the other side of the coin though.
I live within earshot of Whitwell Station, which hosts "Bike nights" every Friday from May to September.
It's getting rather popular, I can hear bikes coming and going for miles in all directions, quite often Jack the Kipper will give it a handfull in front of his mates and it comes reverberating across the fields....And sometimes it's all Jack the Kippers mates doing the same.
Now I am a Motorcyclist of forty years and an enthusiast before that, and I always cock an ear to the sound of a bike..Time was when you could tell what it was by the note.
But when I hear them wailing down the road on a Friday eve, I just shake my head and think "well you're asking to get pulled".

It eventually causes a few complaints and the Police do what they can to please the public.
The gathering places are the obvious targets and normally discreet folk get pulled and have the lettering on their silencers called into question...Fair play really?

.....and that's why i don't ride out on a Friday evening..:mad:

That said I wonder what they would make of my cored 750 silencers with all the Ducati stamps?

[Flip]

Did they have dB meters to pull you or was it just at their judgment?

Blimey!!! Don't give them ideas or we're all fooked- some bikes with standard cans aren't getting through noise tests for track days.

Panigale's, cross plane crank R1's and Super Duke's don't get through MSV's static test apparently.

I presume new bikes are only ride by noise tested to comply with road regulations?

[Darren69]

I know, I always tend to avoid Matlock especially on bank holidays. Road legal Termis would be E stamped wouldn't they not BSAU stamped?

[Dave G]

Matlock was always a target for 'crackdowns', I remember being pulled in there whilst on my FireBlade in the mid 90's, but was then waved on as the bus stop they were using to corral the riders was full so I got away with it then.
I've avoided all these places for a long time, especially at weekends, up here it's the green welly at Tyndrum or along Loch Earn at St Fillans or up the side of Loch Lomond.
They attract the tossers and weekend racers and then as a consequence the police follow.


Just a note for all those thinking that a sticker will somehow give you a get out of jail free card, the traffic cops aren't stupid, a lot of them are also bikers, they know what they ought to be looking at and the vehicle standards you thought you were being judged on can easily be turned into a 'pervert the course of justice' equivelent by trying to pretend stuff is legal when it clearly isn't, this is especially true if they also have a vosa team with them.

Better to have a blank can with any unfotunate markings removed than one that pretends to be legal, a mate of mine used to carry the baffles that made his his Termi's road legal in his rucksack for this very eventuality.

[Flip]

Good points Dave- I'll keep my unmarked cans as they are and hope the Feds think they must be quiet, as surely a clutch can't be louder can it? :chuckle:

[Darren69]

Yes good point and taken. But surely even Termis with dB killers would be deemed illegal if not marked in some way, officially or otherwise? I know they did make some Termis 'homologated for road use' but were they just fitted with dB kilers and stamped? If so I fail to see how running those without the dB killers would be any more noisy (hence illegal) than mine (if only on a technicality of having a sticker)? :\ I'm not trying to make excuses cos I know mine are fully open type cans, and I don't go out of my way to make a nuisance with them. that is how the bike was sold to me by the dealer and with mot etc, it just irks me because I bet they weren't pulling any cars with similar 'unmarked' exhausts, and checking them, just picking bikes.

My bike as with so many Ducati Performance specials and SP type bikes would have originally have been fitted with the 'homologated' cans with the other ones included and I have been looking for a set that would fit but have concluded that they were only made especially for the run of 300 bikes of which only about 40 were imported to the Uk and as most owners immediately swapped them for the others there are none of the other original type available. If anyone knows where I can get a pair of high level oval cans that fit to an 888 style 50mm link pipe with 2 springs please get in touch.

[Dirty]

Meh, can always moody it off with 'I dunno, that's how I bought it'.

I rarely venture into the countryside anyway and I've never heard of such checks in London so fingers crossed :)

[Dirty]

it just irks me because I bet they weren't pulling any cars with similar 'unmarked' exhausts, and checking them, just picking bikes.

To be fair to cars exhausts and emissions are checked and have to be tightly adhered to at MOT time unlike bikes.

[garry]

my mot mon says, unless its stamped "not for road use".. or "track use only".......... its fare game on the road... obviously not it seems.

[Darren69]

To be fair to cars exhausts and emissions are checked and have to be tightly adhered to at MOT time unlike bikes.

I'm sure that's true as far as emissions go, as I know they are strict on that but if that's truly the case why are there so many run of the mill Imprezas and Skylines etc with race exhausts running around and rattling my windows and probably just a loud as my bike not getting pulled over. Some even have stereos so loud that they should carry a health (or at the very least, a good taste) warning. You're not telling me they are legal exhausts. I'm sure if they were all to regularly congregate at the same place however they probably would be. I think that's part of the answer maybe? :)

[SunEye]

my mot mon says, unless its stamped "not for road use".. or "track use only".......... its fare game on the road... obviously not it seems.
A noisy exhaust can pass an MOT. However that does not make it legal. Only having a suitable marking means that it has passed the appropriate noise tests. Without that the police will assume that it is illegal unless you can prove otherwise.

Potentially you could put your bike through the same noise tests that the manufacturers have to in order for the bike to be allowed to be sold for road use. If it passes you can then submit that proof in court and your fine will be waived, but it will probably cost a lot more than your fine to have VOSA noise test your bike.

Details of motorcycle noise testing can be found in section 18 of the Motorcycle Single Vehicle Approval Inspection Manual (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/366046/msva-manual.pdf)

[Dirty]

I'm sure that's true as far as emissions go, as I know they are strict on that but if that's truly the case why are there so many run of the mill Imprezas and Skylines etc with race exhausts running around and rattling my windows and probably just a loud as my bike not getting pulled over. Some even have stereos so loud that they should carry a health (or at the very least, a good taste) warning. You're not telling me they are legal exhausts. I'm sure if they were all to regularly congregate at the same place however they probably would be. I think that's part of the answer maybe? :)

No exhaust is legal unless it's the exhaust the manufacturer put on it or as suneye says you get it tested to prove it hasn't altered emissions (gas and sound) from standard.

Impreza/Skyline/Evo owners are a dedicated bunch and they'll have an MOT exhaust complete with CAT for MOT time and a dustbin sized one without for cruising. There is a big monthly one round here in the summer, saw them last night in fact, sounded great. In fact the Evo is designed with easily removable CAT and it takes about 2 minutes to fit a link pipe, the others are probably similar.
And cars get stopped a lot more than bikes round here trust me. I think part of that is that cars can stop cars whereas they know that if they ask a bike to stop the rider has a choice :chuckle:

[Macman900]

No..they didn't have Db meters, but they were filming various events/situations with a cop and his video camera.

[Dukedesmo]

Is this the same Derbyshire Police that have cut 'hundreds of officers' and will have to cut 'hundreds more' due to funding cuts?

If so, good to see they're allocating their precious resources wisely...

[Nickj]

Details of motorcycle noise testing can be found in section 18 of the Motorcycle Single Vehicle Approval Inspection Manual (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/366046/msva-manual.pdf)

Euro emissions and noise are rolling aren't they... hence the flat spot enginered in to get an edge on the noise test part.

Static tests are notoriously difficult and just sticking a db meter in and revving the bike isn't a kosher test.. see above for the proscribed test conditions... Ambient conditions, specific revs ,,, Which is all pretty pointless as a plod can say that's too loud and it is too loud.

[Zimbo]

Noisy cans may be passed by the MOT inspector, he isn't there to judge whether or not the can is legal. That comes under a completely different set of legislation, covering Construction and Use.
Before adding fake BS numbers to your cans, consider first the potential fallout should the officer decide to prosecute further. Running around with race cans on the road is in contravention of construction and use regulations, a civil offence which may land you with a fine and a rectification notice. Adding fake BS numbers to your can/s is potentially a criminal offence, which could land you a whole lot deeper in the smelly stuff ...

[MerlinPV12]

I have had at least 3 face to face conversations with Motorcycle cops standing next to my bike with the express intention of asking for a clear steer on the legality of my termis, all 3 said no bother unless you're riding like an idiot. Last week a patrol car cop came over to me on a garage forecourt after I had started the bike and said how nice it sounded, he then said "you keep it nice" and gave me the thumbs up! Till now I'd have guessed it would be the idiot/anti social bit that will get you pulled, now not quite so sure!

[Yorkie]

I have had at least 3 face to face conversations with Motorcycle cops standing next to my bike with the express intention of asking for a clear steer on the legality of my termis, all 3 said no bother unless you're riding like an idiot. Last week a patrol car cop came over to me on a garage forecourt after I had started the bike and said how nice it sounded, he then said "you keep it nice" and gave me the thumbs up! Till now I'd have guessed it would be the idiot/anti social bit that will get you pulled, now not quite so sure!

Merlin,

I know a few coppers in North Yorkshire and they are of the same feeling the same 95% of the time ...... then then get their directed tasks, Squires, Helmsley etc...

The clamp downs are usually driven by an increase in casualty rates.

Yorkie

[Nottsbiker]

Saw everyone pulled over as we drove past with the dogs in the back of the Accord.

Ironically the Honda has some kind of after market exhaust on it but like always it's only bikers that get pulled in the UK

[Dirty]

Noisy cans may be passed by the MOT inspector, he isn't there to judge whether or not the can is legal. That comes under a completely different set of legislation, covering Construction and Use.
Before adding fake BS numbers to your cans, consider first the potential fallout should the officer decide to prosecute further. Running around with race cans on the road is in contravention of construction and use regulations, a civil offence which may land you with a fine and a rectification notice. Adding fake BS numbers to your can/s is potentially a criminal offence, which could land you a whole lot deeper in the smelly stuff ...

MOT inspectors use their opinion on whether the noise is 'excessive'. Equally the police only need to formulate an opinion as well, as to whether the exhaust is louder than standard.

My exhaust is not a race exhaust and is in fact legal........ on a Kawasaki! And as it's Italian I'd E mark it rather than BS. I think you'd have to be acting like a total knob for them to go to the bother of checking a number, and even then to try and prove it was added by you rather than a previous owner would be difficult in most cases.

[jerry]

In thailand the cops will bust you for noisy exhaust if it says ternignoni or Zard , arrow etc etc but i took the Termi decals off my cans and put Ducati decals on ,, so now they let me go as its ORIGNAL fitment makers name .... LOL !!!! my mate to the Akrapovic sticker of his R1M yammerhammer cans and stuck a Yamaha stick on and hey ho no more cops hassling about noise ... but they have a lot mor bull**** angles for some bribes ...