Chinese eBay titanium...

[squarehead]

As David D1ckinson says, cheap as chips.... but are they made of the UK's favourite carbohydrate too?

Would you / wouldn't you?

[Wildfire]

Depends on what it's holding on. A screen or fairing maybe. Anything load bearing or structural, off eBay, not a chance.

[Dirty]

Depends what it is?

[utopia]

I tend to judge each item on its own merits.
The more critical the component, the more wary I am.
But I see nothing wrong with Chinese stuff in general...their titanium and ally is as good as anyone else's and they're equally able to copy a component.
I'm probably as wary of any pattern/aftermarket component, no matter where its made, since anything that isn't original will/may not have been through the same testing/proving process.
But, for example, I fitted Chinese billet levers last year and I can't fault them.
And I am currently considering titanium front disc bolts from China too. Ok, they're a critical component, but how different can one titanium bolt be from another made in say, Germany ? Its not like there's loads of sub-standard titanium out there... I would imagine that the stuff is too rare for it to be worth producing.
The reason Chinese stuff is cheap is down to politics, social factors and global development disparities rather than because its (necessarily) sub standard.
Of course, as always, its down to the individual to make their own assessment, and I'm fortunate in that my engineering background enables me to do this fairly effectively.
As another example, I was shy of buying a Chinese clutch slave because that is a working assembly containing multiple components, which seemed to me to be a greater risk as its much more difficult to assess than a single bolt would be.

Summing up.... As usual, the devil is in the detail.
Let the buyer beware but, with care, there are huge savings to be made (if you don't mind the political implications).

[Darren69]

'Caveat emptor'

[squarehead]

I was considering eccentric pinch bolts, fork clamp bolts etc.

I would think materials wouldn't vary massively but tolerances may do.

Also where do the likes of ProBolt and numerous other suppliers actually source their wares? China possibly?

[Darren69]

I don't rate Pro-bolt stuff that much. The titanium axle nuts I had had some laquer coating which flaked off when I tightened them so they were not shiny in some places. Why do they put a coating on?

[Dirty]

I like my cigars to have been rolled on the thighs of Cuban maidens underneath palm trees, I like my suits made in the basements of Saville Row, I like my truffles to have been hunted by sows, I like my Ti to have been turned by 5 yr old Chinese orphans in the dim light of a 24hr sweat shop :mand:

I think Ti is often plated as it's a very weird metal that reacts badly with other metals

[jerry]

I recently got a Regulator for ducati from HK for £16.98 and the manufacturing marks and codes are same as original Ducati one which costs £89 and my mate told me that he got same one for his old VFR from HK and its working for last 3 years .

[Dookbob]

I cant quote on engineering components because I dont buy Chinese made ones, but I do buy Chinese electrical components. The problem being that you have to buy three of everything you need to make sure you get one that is OK, but the three you buy will still be cheaper than one good one that is made elsewhere. Give them a few more years and they will get their act together I,m sure. I,m old enough to remember laughing at the Japanese stuff, but it,s state of the art now.

[Taff666]

Just ought a couple of Chinese brake/clutch levers - fitted perfectly and quality was way above my expectations.

As Dookbob says above, "Give them a few more years........"

And Dookbob, like you I am old enough to remember trashing Jap stuff!!

[Taff666]

Just bought.....(doh!!)

[garry]

chaps, the grade 5 titanium you need for fixings is an alloy, its the blend of these metals that would generally cause problems after manufacture.
grade 1 pure titanium is actually quite soft, but one of the most chemical resistant metals known, but crap for fixings.

the 2 main manufacturers of titanium in the world are china and russia, the majority of american ti is russian, whereas china supplies everyone else, ie probolt, but they would never admit it. Do you think they make there own ??

Unless you pay approx 10x the price for aviation quality you never know the origin, and the only thing you are paying for there is tracability, as every fastener has a batch no and certificate of conformance.

as an example, for the titanium fixings i use in our chrome baths, chemical resistance is more important than strength, 1 fixing, an M6x20 c/sunk cap head, because our company is german, every bloody thing has to have traceability, so we used to pay £19 each !! in quantities over 100. average use 250 -300 per year. for 2014 i changed supplier, a chinese company.... shock horror !!!

average use stayed the same, but with a saving of slightly over £3500 ! on one fixing ......

obviously, for our applications (bike wise) price isnt everything, safety has to be first, if a product looks well machined it probably is, only destructive testing will prove otherwise.

it certainly is a minefield for sure... but gents, please dont believe everything you read, just use your own judgement, and whatever product makes you feel safe on your machine..

[squarehead]

I'd assumed some/most of the titanium marketed in this country is probably of Chinese origin. Hence my original question.

Out of interest does anyone know where PROTI ffr stuff is made? Website looks impressive, and the bolts are forged so tough as. I'd be happy with this stuff holding my axle and rotors on!

www.protiglobal.com

[Wildfire]

I was considering eccentric pinch bolts, fork clamp bolts etc.

I would think materials wouldn't vary massively but tolerances may do.

Also where do the likes of ProBolt and numerous other suppliers actually source their wares? China possibly?

Not sure about Pro Bolt but Race Bolt make all their bolts on premises. Their work is excellent. I was there 2 weeks ago and had a good look round.

[gary tompkins]

I've been using this company for the titanium fixings I have on track bike

http://titanclassics.com/

[iainw]

The Chinese are making lots of stuff already for OEM in the motor trade, Japanese, European and American are now sourcing parts from there for their new vehicles. The quality of stuff varies, and they'll supply it to whatever standard their customer wants to pay for. The trouble is that as we're at the end of the line in this age of ever reducing manufacturing costs and we're the ones that are the final QA testers, so you're taking a chance unless a number of people have already had good use out of the same thing.

I went round the Ducati factory last October, it's basically and assembly plant, everything is bought in, they only machine the cranks now. Most of the stuff is made in the area, frames, wheels, elecs, forks, seat, tyres, brakes etc, they don't even paint tanks and panels there. But who knows where all the components for these parts come from?

[jerry]

when i last went round triumph factory in thailand and the UK Hinkley factory , parts were being sourced from

Thailand
UK
Germany
Italy
France
Taiwan
Korea
Japan
China
Malaysia
Spain
India
Sweden
Denmark
Austria

its the same at Ducati factory in Thailand .and HD in USA even the Honda factory in thailand making CBF650 was getting parts from Malaysia, indonesia,japan,china and italy