Moto GP yesterday

[pompone]

what did you think? At least I went the whole way without falling asleep..won't actually mind if they made pitstop compulsory if I think about it in terms of possible strategies etc..

[slob]

Barking mad, at least the championship is alive :-D
Gutted about the Moto2. Was the Moto3 close enough for you?

[Albie]

Moto 3 was close wasn't it. I thought the local aussie was gonna nick it

[pompone]

Barking mad, at least the championship is alive :-D
Gutted about the Moto2. Was the Moto3 close enough for you?

Yeah, shame for the Moto2, Redding hasn't done much wrong this year but yet... Moto 3 was :eyepopping: Think about it, as there's no real difference between hard and soft tires anymore, or at least not to the extent of the '90, to play with fuel load could make for good racing.

[BigOz]

Next years CRT rules could make MotoGP more interesting, 25% more fuel than prototype and more engine swaps. It could be close with the CRTs outpacing the prototypes at the end of the race when they start reducing power to make it to the finish on just 20l.

[Dirty]

It was an excellent race. Not sure I'd want pit stops to become a feature but it was good fun and An excellent way to stretch the chpshp to the last race. Lorenzo has ridden his pistachios off this year, very impressive.

[bluestoesonnose]

Absolute farce, what does it matter where you do your nine lap / eleven lap split? If they couldn't go past ten laps with the tyres then those changing bikes on lap nine shouldn't have been able to finish the race as it would be unsafe!

Absolute cluster, don't care who wins now, this makes F1 seem organised!

[pompone]

Absolute farce, what does it matter where you do your nine lap / eleven lap split? If they couldn't go past ten laps with the tyres then those changing bikes on lap nine shouldn't have been able to finish the race as it would be unsafe!

Absolute cluster, don't care who wins now, this makes F1 seem organised!

The farce was down to Bridgestone (and to a certain point the race organizers). The riders were told not to go past Lap 10, Honda tried to do a F1 type of pistop (clear air etc.) and thought they were cleverer than anyone else. As it turns out they were wrong.:rolleyes:

[DrD]

The race organisers changed the length with one hour to go, no rider briefings and paper copies of the changes sent to the grid prior to warm up lap.
The pit re-entry speed limitation made the exit dangerous too (see the MM and JL contact).

[Dirty]

Rules are rules. It was pretty clear which laps you could and couldn't pit on. Strange excuses from Honda. I guess 'We thought we could pit on lap 11!' Sounds better than 'we have difficulty counting' :)

[slob]

I was wondering if a Honda employee is expected to commit ritual suicide to atone for the error.

[jonzi]

Probably should have come in a bit sooner.

http://www.trackdayriders.co.uk/tdr/forum/uploads/4585/1385445_10151808970502670_266641166_n.jpg

He looked to be all over the shop and didn't he nearly have an off on that last illicit lap?

[Black Bob]

Total farce. It was a **** race and they probably should have just cancelled it if the tyres were not up to it and fined the tyre company for not even having bothered testing there.

If MM loses it now, it'll all be because of that pit stop and the fact he's wiped the floor with everybody would count for nothing.

[slob]

That's racing... 95% disappointment, 5% elation

I'm looking forward to Valencia!

[utopia]

In retrospect, it would've made more sense to have had two separate races and decide the result on aggregate times.
Or simply to have had one single, shortened race.
I don't really care about which team is able to swap bikes the fastest.
And, as already pointed out, it wasn't exactly the safest procedure to adopt.

Or maybe they should have ditched the racing altogether and allocated the points according to who could last longest in the ring with a boxing kangaroo.

On the plus side though, I agree that Lorenzo's efforts this year have been admirable and I'm not displeased that he got lucky with the points this time.
Kinda makes up for being run off the track by Marquez earlier in the season.
But yes, Marquez still deserves to win the title, and probably still will.

Absolutely gutting for Scott Redding though.
And he so nearly got away with it....it looked like it wasn't the landing which broke his wrist but trying to hold on to the bike and getting his hand caught.

Wasn't such a good round for the seagull either.

[Dirty]

I actually think both MM and Lorenzo deserve the title. Won't be disappointed either way. One incident does not a season make. If Lorenzo hadn't broke his collar bone, if Lorenzo hadn't raced anyway and grabbed points, if MM hadn't crashed in Italy, if Honda could count, if Danny hadn't broke his collarbone, if MM hadn't broke Danny's TC, if if if if if if.....

I know what MM is going to ask Santa for this year

http://s24.postimg.org/3jypni41x/lap_counter_4.jpg

[slob]

... and fined the tyre company for not even having bothered testing there...

Fairly sure they weren't given the chance, testing with MotoGP bikes is highly regulated

[Dirty]

Fairly sure they weren't given the chance, testing with MotoGP bikes is highly regulated

Yep, and to be fair Dunlop had issues too and they had data from WSB, who also had issues, to work with.

Testing should have been done though, it was foreseeable and both Bridgestone and the MGP safety body should have flagged it up and requested a day or 2 post resurface but hindsight is 20/20. That's the problem with 1 make tyre supplier series. You can bet they'd have asked for a test if they had been in competition.

[slob]

Can you imagine the chaos if there were still two manufacturers and for example Bridgestone could only handle 10 laps but Michelin had for some reason managed full race distance.

[wezrvf]

I thought it was a cracking race. Don't agree with the ruling on MM but it certainly made exciting viewing.

MM has been a breath of fresh air this season but i don't agree with the statement, if MM loses this year it is because of the pit stop. Lets face it, would he still be ahead if JL and to a certain extent DP didn't break their collar bones ? i think probably not. It is this that has let MM overtake on points and get so far ahead. thoughts...............?

[Dirty]

Can you imagine the chaos if there were still two manufacturers and for example Bridgestone could only handle 10 laps but Michelin had for some reason managed full race distance.

It happened in F1 before. USGP 05 and similarly the track had been resurfaced! That was a complete Michelin £@ck up trying to push the limits. They should have been more conservative and paid the ultimate price. To be fair testing F1 at the Brickyard is not possible though.

[perkles]

Lorenzo did the right thing and got his head down ,hes riding the arse of that M1

[wezrvf]

haha. I think there are a lot of reasons why the points have ended up like they have however it is very un-Lorenzo like to have so many crashes and injuries, i dont think MM will have the same luxery next season.

When they where speaking to Stoner i thought wouldn't it be amazing if Stoner came back to see if he was faster than MM.....Amazing. He is testing the new Honda after all !!! :)

So what do you think..........MM or CS...........Who is the fastest ??

[slob]

Looking at Jonzi's picture of the tyre, it would seem Bridgestone's 10 lap estimate was spot on, the 11th lap could easily have ended in a fatality. As has previously been said: "Rules are rules" they put them there for safety in this instance. I don't think cancelling the race is an option either, with race fans having travelled from all over Australia, which is only slightly larger than Europe after all.

[buzzbomb]

It happened in F1 before. USGP 05 and similarly the track had been resurfaced! That was a complete Michelin £@ck up trying to push the limits. They should have been more conservative and paid the ultimate price. To be fair testing F1 at the Brickyard is not possible though.

And I bet michelin are still paying one way or another...:banghead:

[pompone]

So what do you think..........MM or CS...........Who is the fastest ??

Stoner gets my vote here. And looking at the stats I don't think Marquez has dominated the year: same wins as Lorenzo on a much better machine (just look at Barbera results to get an idea of how good the Honda is..) and the luck of not picking up any major injuries

[pompone]

As has previously been said: "Rules are rules"
Not always Slob thought. The overtake on Rossi at Laguna was outside the track. Rules dictates you must overtake within the limits of the track. He should have picked up a penalty, just as much as Rossi on Stoner in 08.

[Black Bob]

MM rookie year vs. CS rookie year... no brainer.

CS is still an ungracious little twat, damning MM with faint praise. I'm glad he's gone, he's not been missed.

[perkles]

MM rookie year vs. CS rookie year... no brainer.

CS is still an ungracious little twat, damning MM with faint praise. I'm glad he's gone, he's not been missed.
snap ,i thought he was a serial whinger

[pompone]

MM rookie year vs. CS rookie year... no brainer.

CS is still an ungracious little twat, damning MM with faint praise. I'm glad he's gone, he's not been missed.

CS rookie year wasn't on a fully fledged HRC Factory bike thought..

[utopia]

Well I do miss Casey.
Ok, he may have had the odd whinge, but who wouldn't when you get overtaken by an off-track manoeuvre ?
He took motoGP to an entirely new level.
And of course, remains the only rider in recent times to be able to get results on the Ducati.
But its hardly surprising that he quit after the treatment he got from some of the fans.
The brit fans at Donington were particularly vile towards him, in my opinion.
I'd love to see him return.

[buzzbomb]

MM rookie year vs. CS rookie year... no brainer.

CS is still an ungracious little twat, damning MM with faint praise. I'm glad he's gone, he's not been missed.

Well BB I'm not a CS fan either BUT it just go's to show how good he was on the ducati as nobody else has even got close to doing what he did on it.

And how they can call us Brits whinging poms is totally beyond me.

[Black Bob]

CS rookie year wasn't on a fully fledged HRC Factory bike thought..

Lucky for him - he'd have probably killed himself on it.

OK so maybe I am being a bit harsh - he didn't crash it all the time.

But the whinging just annoyed me. Just look at different between a CS post-race interview and an MM post-race interview, and see a kid who is enjoying himself as much as we enjoy watching him.

Nah, good though CS was, good riddance to him.

[pompone]

Lucky for him - he'd have probably killed himself on it.

OK so maybe I am being a bit harsh - he didn't crash it all the time.

But the whinging just annoyed me. Just look at different between a CS post-race interview and an MM post-race interview, and see a kid who is enjoying himself as much as we enjoy watching him.

Nah, good though CS was, good riddance to him.

I do judge racers for what they do on a bike, not on the post race interviews ;)

[Dirty]

I'm with Bob on belly pans and Casey Stoner. What he did on a bike gets him the records, what he says in interviews gets him the fans and plaudits. At the risk of inciting Godwin's law the Nazi's had better looking uniforms, technologically superior equipment and tactics but their PR was a mess :)

[Black Bob]

I do judge racers for what they do on a bike, not on the post race interviews ;)

That's a fair point, dude. He was a genius, no denying it. Shame on me for not being able to be that impartial - I'm usually quite tolerant of such personalities.

He resides on my list of Top 10 "talented but irritating" people, along with Paul McCartney and Sting. (Although the jury is till out on whether McCartney had any talent.)

[pompone]

That's a fair point, dude. He was a genius, no denying it. Shame on me for not being able to be that impartial - I'm usually quite tolerant of such personalities.

He resides on my list of Top 10 "talented but irritating" people, along with Paul McCartney and Sting. (Although the jury is till out on whether McCartney had any talent.)

Can't stand Paul "have to feature on everything" McCartney either so I do have my faults too ;) and if I have to be honest I don't think he's that talented..

[Black Bob]

And it's nothing to do with Casey being Australian - Troy Bayliss was my favourite racer ever.

I'm with Bob on belly pans and Casey Stoner

Pound me, dude. :)

Can't stand Paul "have to feature on everything" McCartney either so I do have my faults too ;) and if I have to be honest I don't think he's that talented..

Pound me, DUDE! :D

[pompone]

Pound me, dude. :)

And there's an image I would have rather done without.. ;)




Pound me, dude. :D
Is Ok, I leave you to Dirty, nomen omen.. :D

[wezrvf]

I think stoner has been greatly missed this season. Anybody who says otherwise is wrong.

[Black Bob]

Not THAT!

The other pound.

I'm not Bob, I'm not black and I'm not... "that". (Not that there's anything wrong with "that".)

[pompone]

Not THAT!

The other pound.



Are you suggesting I should pay for it too?:confused:

[Black Bob]

I think stoner has been greatly missed this season. Anybody who says otherwise is wrong.

Thank you for putting me firmly in my place with your bombproof argument.

;)

[Black Bob]

Can't stand Paul "have to feature on everything" McCartney either so I do have my faults too

That's not a fault. That's a quality to be celebrated. Hence the next beer that I see in your hand will have been paid for by me. :)

[Dirty]

That's not a fault. That's a quality to be celebrated. Hence the next beer that I see in your hand will have been paid for by me. :)

I hate Justin Bieber, JLS and One Direction kerching kerching :)

[perkles]

cliff richard is high in my top ten of annoying talentless pricks

[Black Bob]

Oh feck, what have I started?


DONKEY!!!!

[wezrvf]

I am not arguing mate Just not sure how you can say one of the best riders to race in MotoGP can retire and not be missed ? Don't get me wrong I wasn't rooting for him all the time but in terms of a viewers sport, he is missed, I thought that was pretty much a given.

[Black Bob]

I am not arguing mate Just not sure how you can say one of the best riders to race in MotoGP can retire and not be missed ? Don't get me wrong I wasn't rooting for him all the time but in terms of a viewers sport, he is missed, I thought that was pretty much a given.

It's OK, there was a winky ( ;) )

And why not argue - it's a healthy thing, right?

I said what I said really easily because I would argue that, in my view, he is not missed - has this year not been more exciting to watch than the previous 2 years? For me it has.

And with less whinging. :D

[Akita Boy]

Oh feck, what have I started?


DONKEY!!!!

That just made me laugh out loud.

And by using the safe word the thread is instantly back on topic!

[Black Bob]

And by using the safe word the thread is instantly back on topic!

Wasn't it though ? Hehe.

[Dirty]

I am not arguing mate Just not sure how you can say one of the best riders to race in MotoGP can retire and not be missed ? Don't get me wrong I wasn't rooting for him all the time but in terms of a viewers sport, he is missed, I thought that was pretty much a given.

It's an odd thing isn't it. I've been discussing similar stuff recently relating to F1. Sometimes a rider/driver can dominate, win everything almost to the point of tedium and yet be almost universally loved - Rossi. Someone else comes along and does the same thing yet is despised/disliked - Stoner.

A lot is personality/charisma. Some is riding/driving style. A lot is the way they win/lose which is linked to personality.

But in summary I miss Stoner about as much as the BBC misses 'Jim'll fix it' and 'Cartoon Time‘ :)

[wezrvf]

Haha good point chaps. I would love to see a Casey/ Mark face off

[slob]

Bring back Cartoon Time!

[Black Bob]

I don't think cancelling the race is an option either, with race fans having travelled from all over Australia, which is only slightly larger than Europe after all.

Fair point, I didn't really think that one through.

[utopia]

According to the bbc commentary, Philip island was deserted due to all the aussie fans staying home cos casey wasn't there.
Then again, any aussie front runner would probably have done.

I still reckon it would have been better to run two races and aggregate the times.
Or perhaps better still, allocate half points for each race.
Basically still a pitstop, just a longer one which is exactly the same time for everyone.
How bizarre, with all the money, effort and technology put into going fast on a prototype motorcycle, that the result should depend on pit stop mayhem.

[Dirty]

To be fair, if you exclude penalty, the positions pretty much remained the same after the stops. They were quite entertaining as well. Bit undignified due to so little practice but fun to watch.

[Kato]

Well BB I'm not a CS fan either BUT it just go's to show how good he was on the ducati as nobody else has even got close to doing what he did on it.

And how they can call us Brits whinging poms is totally beyond me.

Is Widnes even in Britain ?????????;)

[Kato]

Can you imagine the chaos if there were still two manufacturers and for example Bridgestone could only handle 10 laps but Michelin had for some reason managed full race distance.

Or if MM and Jorge or even Tossi had trashed their bike in morning warm up and only had the one left on which to race, then what the hell would Dorna have done.

Whole thing should have been cancelled or even better they should all been lent Moto2 bikes for the race drawing lots to see who gets which bike.

Then during the podium ceremony sack Bridgstone as sole supplier, take the remaining tyres and place them neatly around Carmelo Ezpeleta and calmly IGNITE:twak:

[Dirty]

I think next race they should keep the same format except that when they come in to change bikes they have to complete a 48 piece jigsaw puzzle whilst singing 'Barbie Girl' before getting on it!

[perkles]

sorry if i offended any casey stoner and cliff richard fans :)

[Dirty]

Sorry if I offended any Rolf Harris fans :)

[wezrvf]

hahaha, i like that idea dirty. Maybe run in circles, looking down around a brush handle ten times too !!

[Darren69]

hahaha, i like that idea dirty. Maybe run in circles, looking down around a brush handle ten times too !!

Why not 11?

[Dirty]

Why not 11?

I think 10 times clockwise and 10 times anti clockwise is the standard 18-30 rules :)

[Dirty]

Just watched it again on Eurosport. On the point of Pedrosa's penalty, drop one place, which he 'served' when MM was BF'd. Now it seems to me that it was no penalty at all. Of course it was a particular set of circumstances on this occasion but dropping a place in a 'normal' race needn't be much of a penalty to a smart rider. Is there a rule to stop them just going a little wide, letting someone through then undercutting them? Equally if he'd had a 25 second lead it would be a massive penalty.

In F1 he'd have got a drive through which is the other end of the scale. Far too harsh a punishment. Not that it is as common as F1 but where is the middle ground. There has to be a penalty but dropping a place is too random.

[pompone]

Just watched it again on Eurosport. On the point of Pedrosa's penalty, drop one place, which he 'served' when MM was BF'd. Now it seems to me that it was no penalty at all. Of course it was a particular set of circumstances on this occasion but dropping a place in a 'normal' race needn't be much of a penalty to a smart rider. Is there a rule to stop them just going a little wide, letting someone through then undercutting them? Equally if he'd had a 25 second lead it would be a massive penalty.

In F1 he'd have got a drive through which is the other end of the scale. Far too harsh a punishment. Not that it is as common as F1 but where is the middle ground. There has to be a penalty but dropping a place is too random.

Agree (especially on the F1 part). A fit punishment should be adding 5 seconds to the rider total race time. Simple.

[Dirty]

I agree. The problem is the organisers don't like to do that because, they say, that could mean that 2nd over the line is actually 3rd or 4th and the viewers don't understand that! Who are these viewers?