Clip-ons, straights and other handlebar mods.

[utopia]

I had a sit on Slob's newly rebuilt monster yesterday.
It has clip-ons fitted, with a bit of a rise to them.
I was pleasantly surprised to find that the riding position was actually quite comfy and not so much of a stretch as I had imagined.

As a result, I'm thinking of fitting a set of straight bars to my monster, using the std risers and clamp.
This would work on my bike as it has the basic, non-adjustable Showa forks so there's no need for clearance at the fork-top adjusters.

I have a set of what are probably called streetfighter bars, in polished/anodised ally.
These have a rather long, straight central section with a single bend on each side.
They are also wider overall than I would want.
I can easily cut an inch or so off each end, but that would still leave them wider than I would like.
So, I was thinking of cutting them in half, removing a bit from the straight central section, then rejoining them with a tight-fitting central "slug" to strengthen the joint. (I can easily turn up something suitable on my lathe). I might use some sort of bonding agent on the joint.
I'm thinking that the clamping force at the risers would be sufficient to avoid any tendency for one side to be able to twist independently of the other.
Incidentally, my bike has the one-piece handlebar clamp rather than the two separate ones. As well as possibly making for a stronger assembly than individual clamps, this has the advantage of hiding the proposed join in the bars.

I reckon this should work ok, particularly as it may only be a relatively short-term thing to test the general layout before buying a one-piece bar, or even going the whole hog and getting some clip-ons.
But your considered opinions on the proposal would be appreciated.

[Dave G]

Get the clip-ons!


Or perhaps try some jota/ace bars as an alternative.
If you do opt for clip ons then consider dropping you clocks and headlight for a sleeker and more compact look, it's not a technically difficult job, the hardest bit is getting the wires and cables back into the space.

[pompone]

Clip ons are more comfortable with rearset I find. I have a set of old rizoma which sit on the top clamp, probably easy enough for you to replicate as they're really rare now..

[Dirty]

Clip ons are more comfortable with rearset I find. I have a set of old rizoma which sit on the top clamp, probably easy enough for you to replicate as they're really rare now..

And if you did replicate them you'd have a customer here.

[gary tompkins]

I've got renthal ultra low bars on the trike

Better than stock sit up and beg position, but not as radical or wrist heavy as full clip ons

[utopia]

Clip ons are more comfortable with rearset I find. I have a set of old rizoma which sit on the top clamp, probably easy enough for you to replicate as they're really rare now..

And if you did replicate them you'd have a customer here.

That's quite interesting.
Do you have any pics, Max ?

I'm not sure about jota bars.
They always seem unnecessarily cumbersome and, while they might be useful in initially finding a good position, the adjustment then becomes redundant.

I already have rearsets and I currently have Renthal ultra-low bars fitted.
Being the tall, skinny type, even though the bars (which aren't much different to std) are pushed well forward, my stance is still rather upright.

Also, although I've trimmed about 20mm off each end, the bars are still wider than the bike needs.

I've just been out to the shed to have a closer look and I reckon that the proposed new set-up will drop the bars by about 50mm, as well as shortening them by 50mm each side.
Also I can arrange for the grips to lie at a more comfortable angle.
I think its time to get the hacksaw out.

I could buy some new bars, but I kinda like this sort of mod where, with a bit of ingenuity, you can sometimes end up with a very finely tuned solution without spending any money at all.
I guess it holds more of the "shed-built" spirit that way too.

I also find the original one-piece bar clamp makes a very useful surface on which to stick my cardboard and blu-tac sat-nav alternative.
And maintenance reminder notes like "no oil" or "don't squeeze the brake lever". :freak:

I did consider cutting a sort of mortice and tenon in the joint faces of the cut handlebar to stop any twisting, but I don't think its really necessary.

[pompone]

http://carad.ebayimg.com/i4/01/a/000/79/0f/fbe0_4.JPG
Not on my bike but that's 'em. But I would do some mods to the base design. Straight bar don't look right IMO.

[Mr Gazza]

Utopia. The bars you describe as "Streetfighter bars" are what I would call Vincent straights.

I want to fit some on mine but I have the high protruding adjusters, so I will be looking for some higher clamps (risers) at some point.

You might want to speak to Darren, as he will have some "straight" clip on bars coming up for sale soon.

Buddy I feel the need to save you from yourself regarding cutting and shutting your bars...
Please don't do it, if only not to frighten me...

It sounds downright dangerous. The forces on the bars when you do an emergency stop are quite large, and generally larger than you might imagine in ordinary riding.
As an experiment, put the end of a handle bar in just one clamp, then give it a wiggle against the steering lock, and draw your own conclusions.

A freind of mine had the bars on his Triumph break due to his rather physical riding style, not I might add from any dropping damage. he would steer rather violently by yanking on the bars to get her down, and must have eventually fatigued the bar..??

Surely it would be easier to put a couple of bends in a bit of 7/8 stainless tube ?....Or buy some shorter bars..??

[perkles]

ive got renthal straight bars on mine and they are a good compromise

[Dirty]

ive got renthal straight bars on mine and they are a good compromise

From what I could see I think I like the look of yours. Got any better pics?

[perkles]

From what I could see I think I like the look of yours. Got any better pics?
will take some later for you

[Dukedesmo]

I've got the Renthal flat bars and they are indeed flat, so no rise in them although they have a slight rearward bend.

I do have an extra 30mm bar riser to clear the fork adjusters, so Renthal low bars were too high. The flats probably sit at a similar height to the lows without the extra riser which, I think is about the same as the standard setup - I find them about right.

I've got a set of clip-ons that fit (under the yoke) but they are way too low as one of the reasons I wanted a Monster was a more upright riding position.

[Darren69]

I have some of these on mine at the moment but am going to be changing to some lower ones:

http://store.speedymoto.com/tall-boys-clip-ons-p223.aspx

[crust]

Utopia - I've had Jota bars in the past and you'd be surprised how often you change bar position when its a 10 minute job.

Going on a bimble - up they go

Out for a thrash / trackday - down

Bit of back ache - move them slightly

Going to Scotland, comfy for Mway part, down for hooning in the Glens.

[utopia]

Buddy I feel the need to save you from yourself regarding cutting and shutting your bars...
Please don't do it, if only not to frighten me...

It sounds downright dangerous. The forces on the bars when you do an emergency stop are quite large, and generally larger than you might imagine in ordinary riding.
As an experiment, put the end of a handle bar in just one clamp, then give it a wiggle against the steering lock, and draw your own conclusions.




Thanks for your concern, Gazza.
In fact I was kinda hoping for a comment like yours to reinforce my own wariness about doing it.
However, the more I think about it the less wary I become.
There will be very little stress on the central section, between the clamps. I can't see the bars being any more likely to snap.
I also doubt very much that there would ever be enough tensile load on the bars to cause the joint to separate.
My main concern was that one side might turn in the clamp, independently of the other side. But there are various ways I could overcome this including bonding the connecting slug in place, or drilling and pinning through the joint. Even joining them with a large stud maybe, though that's my least preferred method as it would weaken the section a bit and cause problems with getting the angle of the bends equal on both sides. Or the mortice and tenon idea.
In fact, the clamping area on each side will be very similar to that on normal clip-ons anyway.

I may well buy some Renthal straights or normal clip-ons eventually, but my cut and shut method will allow me to try things out before splashing any cash.
Also it will enable me to keep the bars narrow by minimising the length of the central section.
It would be interesting to know the length of the central section on the flat Renthals. Is there any chance that you could measure yours and let me know, Perkles/Dukedesmo ?

[bluestoesonnose]

Got some Jota bars kicking about somewhere....

[Mr Gazza]

I feel like I've just been an old misery and pee'd on your fireworks Utopia..:D

The cutting and shutting is something i would definatly not do myself but...
.If you make a very tight slug to go inside the bars, that is long enough to be in both clamps, then... Make a lengthwise slit in each bar at the clamping point so that when clamped, the bars can grip the slug also..a bit like a collet.
I would also pin each bar half to the slug, nearer the join.

Just remembered another incident of bar breakage...It was at the recepion tent of a AJS&Matchless rally, when a fellow rolled up and went to put his bike on the stand and one half of the bars came off in his hand..!!!!...I suppose the bars could well have been 30+ years old though.

Dukedesmo..I want to do exactly what you have done with your bars.
The stock riser on my "S" model is already taller than normal but another 30mm would do the trick as you describe....Where can I get hold of risers like yours??

[Dukedesmo]

It would be interesting to know the length of the central section on the flat Renthals. Is there any chance that you could measure yours and let me know, Perkles/Dukedesmo ?

Renthal's website gives bar dimensions;

http://www.renthalroad.com/File/product_78handlebars.aspx

Although it doesn't list 'flat bars' but the 'road sports' have the same part no. (658-02) and look the same so maybe they've rebranded them?

[Dukedesmo]

Dukedesmo..I want to do exactly what you have done with your bars.
The stock riser on my "S" model is already taller than normal but another 30mm would do the trick as you describe....Where can I get hold of risers like yours??

Don't remember where I got them from but they are 'SW-Motech' bar risers and it looks like they make them in 20mm, 25mm, 30mm and 50mm, see here for a seller;

http://www.bykebitz.co.uk/motorcycle-handlebars/sw-motech-motorcycle-handlebar-risers.html

Mine are the 30mm in silver and they fit on top of the existing Monster risers - although they were provided with bolts I think I had to get some longer ones to go through the entire riser assembly...

[perkles]

heres mine
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/980308_10152076068544305_1686551149_o.jpg

[utopia]

Thanks Perkles, that is a really useful pic.
I can now tell that the central section of the Renthals is about the same length as on the flat bars that I have.
This means that I'm likely to stick with my modified/shortened ones as I'd like to get them as narrow as is reasonably possible.
I can also get a good idea of how the brake and clutch lines will lie, which will make it much easier to make the cut the central section in about the right place first time.
Thanks.

Your "pee on fireworks" comment made me chuckle, Gazza.
I also rather like your "slot and clamp" idea.
That was exactly the sort of inspiration I was looking for.
I'll certainly bear it in mind, though I might try and think of a slight adaptation of it.
Initial thoughts are that the slot, protruding slightly outside the clamp area, might actually cause a minor weakness in the bar (and right where the bending moment is greatest, for that matter).
On the other hand, if I'm happy with the result, I may just get someone to run a weld around the slugged joint. Its hidden under the bar clamp, so it won't show. And to my eye, such scars only add to the patina of the bike anyway, as long as they're well done.

Obviously, much of the reason for doing it this way lies in my budget restrictions but I must say that I'm beginning to see some advantage in my low cost perspective.
It kinda focuses your attention very keenly on exactly what you really want to achieve, and how best to "engineer" a solution, rather than being tempted by shiny but perhaps less effective, off the shelf, bling mods.
The results seem to have a bit more purity of purpose somehow.
I'm guessing that Yorkie's budget 750ss project will have similar characteristics.
And for me, that's exactly what a monster is designed to be.

[Darren69]

Can you clear your inbox please Jeff?

[Mr Gazza]

Obviously, much of the reason for doing it this way lies in my budget restrictions but I must say that I'm beginning to see some advantage in my low cost perspective.
It kinda focuses your attention very keenly on exactly what you really want to achieve, and how best to "engineer" a solution, rather than being tempted by shiny but perhaps less effective, off the shelf, bling mods.
The results seem to have a bit more purity of purpose somehow.
I'm guessing that Yorkie's budget 750ss project will have similar characteristics.
And for me, that's exactly what a monster is designed to be.

Hear hear...Ditto on that philosophy..!

Trying to dry the gunpowder out a bit here..:biggrin:
You are probably right about the slits being a start point for a fatigue crack, this could be reduced a bit, I suppose by drilling a small hole at the end of each slit...But it would still be a worry.

Would somthing like this be more what you are looking for???
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/170999553847?lpid=83&device=c&adtype=pla&crdt=0&ff3=1&ff11=ICEP3.0.0&ff12=67&ff13=80&ff14=83&ff19=0

[Mr Gazza]

Sorry Dukedesmo.
I forgot to say thanks for the info regarding the riser extenders...Thank you.

Do you know if the one piece Ducati top clamp can still be used with the extenders?

[utopia]

Yep, those bars are more like what I have in mind Gazza, though they'd need to be ally and not chromed steel.
But yes, with a much shorter central section like those, rather than the wider bars that I have, and about 24 ins total width.
I got out the hacksaw last night and cut the bars in half, removing enough to reduce them down to about 26 ins wide, which is the same as my current Renthals.
Joined them temporarily with a handy sized bit of nylon tube, after which a trial fitting showed that they should fit quite well, though I'm hoping to be able to remove a little more from each end eventually.
Throttle cables look likely to be the biggest problem as they now have a rather tight bend and the throttle doesn't return properly yet, but I'm sure I'll be able to tweek that.
The switchgear etc does get close to the tank on full lock now, but again I think I should be able to avoid any actual contact without having to readjust the lockstops to reduce the already limited turning circle.
And I think my (homemade) handguards will still fit without interfering with my (homemade) mini screen.

Its looking good so far.
And on closer inspection, I think that there's enough material to allow me to drill and pin the central slug to lock both halves securely together.

[utopia]

And also, re. the risers......

I've seen some that fit on top of the std risers, which are a more complicated shape than seems necessary.
I noticed that it would be relatively easy to make a pair of custom riser extenders which fit below the std risers and therefore need to be no more complicated than a simple flat spacer with two holes for the clamp bolts and a bit of filing to match their outer edges to the shape of the original risers.
A couple of longer bolts and job's a good 'un.
I may even need to adopt this for my own new set-up, if clearances get a bit tight.

[Dukedesmo]

Sorry Dukedesmo.
I forgot to say thanks for the info regarding the riser extenders...Thank you.

Do you know if the one piece Ducati top clamp can still be used with the extenders?

No worries, yes the one-piece top clamp still fits OK. Although I used the 2 separate clamps that were supplied because I preferred the open to the bar look.

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/attachment.php?attachmentid=17385&d=1382389458