Hello and 600/750?

[Nwsparky]

Hi all not ridden in 12 years but at 40 I'm thinking of getting back in the saddle! I've looked at the usual jap 600 suspects but realised I could get a Ducati for similar dosh! At 5ft 5 I like the low height and love the monster style. My wife isn't keen on me taking up biking again but I think if it's an older model that I can tinker with as well as ride shell give in rather than me ordering a new R6 and race leathers!
All this has got me looking at monsters... I'm told that I will soon be fed up with a 600s power and I should look for a 750 minimum but they are like hens teeth! I missed one on eBay at the weekend it was gone in a day!
There's a 600 not to far from me 17 years young in good condition and fair money I'm tempted to have a look at that?
What's the experts opinion? I will only be dry local plodding/cleaning/tinkering with the bike as I say not ridden for a good while...
Cheers

[JuZ]

Go and have a look and see what you think, the 600 doesn't feel slow thanks to a good dollop of torque ifyou stay off the motorways, it's all about maintaining speed through the corners with the little 600, plus at 5'5" I wouldn't have thought you were going to make it struggle to pull you about.

I'm 5'7" and had a 600 for a year and was very happy with it, then a 900 came up at the right price.....

[gary tompkins]

Seat and suspension mods will normally drop seat height a few inches

[utopia]

The air-cooled, 2-valve monsters are a delight to tinker with. Access is excellent and, though valve clearances are a bit tricky to set, everything else is pretty simple.
I can't really speak for the 600, but I can say that the 750 is a lovely bike, and I'm still not hankering after changing mine for a bigger model after 6 yrs ownership. They are less common, but perhaps not quite as rare as you might think.
Also, I believe the 750s fall into the same insurance group as the 600s, so no forfeit there.
Either way, for preference, I'd be inclined to go for a late model, and benefit from their various development upgrades such as 3-phase alternator, external clutch slave, lighter wheels, etc. but its not a big deal.
The other question might be "carbs or injection". Carbs are simpler but will ice up in autumn/winter unless you dose the fuel with pro-fst. Injection avoids this but is more complex and any component failure could be difficult to trace and costly to fix.
As you point out, older monsters are good value biking these days, and particularly if you do your own servicing.
Whichever model you go for, be prepared to fall in love with it.

[Nwsparky]

My nearest recent biking experience was a Westfield Megablade which was great fun. I stripped it down quite a bit, replaced, painted and cleaned everything I could myself. It was part of the fun, in the end though £8k was too much to have sat there waiting for a sunny Sunday! A £1500 bike however can sit and get pampered without a worry, it will be a toe in the water bike so I'm not concerned to much with performance more with character and condition. I could buy an 04 for £2.5k which is also appealing being more modern but looks are very similar and I just think ill have more fun fettling an old timer?....

[JuZ]

Old ones are better :)

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a20/juz13/Ducati/IMG_23102_zps22555404.jpg

[Nickj]

LOL Looked at that pic and thought mid /west sussex, its the wall and the houses roof line and stack that gives it away.

Personally I'd go for a 750 but then I am biased and on my second one. They'll all go to good mileages without too much hassle, mines at 62K and doing about 1K a month! So as long as there's a service history OR you know the bikes history don't sweat a high number, it's a good bargaining chip in anycase to get the price down.
The main things you want to be happy about are (a) belt changes annually or about 12K but no less frequently than bi-anually even if the miles are low and (b) oil changes, mine gets a change at 3K, new filter and change at 6K and it's running nicely.
Otherwise they are pretty much all tough, and reliable and fiddlers delight ;)

[Mr Gazza]

Tch...! It doesn't matter how many times you post that picture Juz..
..You are not going to make me any more jealous:mand:.

I have a few questions about the 750 model but I won't hi-jack your thread Nwsparky....Good hunting for your Monster.

Cheers

Gazza

[Nwsparky]

Can I have yours Juz? That's lovely!

[Nwsparky]

Forgive my laziness but does anyone know the end to end length of an early monster? Just wondering if my Reno traffic could manage?.....

[tricky73]

Welcome i am a newbie myself i own a 750 and ts fantastic mine goes in my 8x6 shed no problem if thats any help otherwise i can measure it tomorrow

[DrD]

According to wiki ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ducati_Monster ), wheelbase is 1,44 cm (57 in), my manual lists 143cm with overall length (including tea tray) at: 209cm

[Nwsparky]

Cheers tricky/Dr, I've checked on tha tinterweb, it fits, next question is how would I get it in there...? 4 people or a ramp I guess...?

[JuZ]

They're only 180kg, so 3 people max

[Nickj]

How do you get it in there??

If it's a shed then through the door as the windows are usually too small.

If it's a van then a ramp to drive it in, half a scaffold boards about right, longer and it can bend, shorter and the pipe grounds.
If there's a side door then ace, reverse process and ride out.

If that idea seems just too scarey then a minimum of two and a ramp (AKA scaffold board)

[JuZ]

Can I have yours Juz? That's lovely!

Thanks, but no :p

[tricky73]

yeah either 2 and a ramp or 3 and a lump of wood to go through the wheels me and mate used the wood technique on a Yamaha Royal star which was bloody heavy so the monster should easy in comparison

[Nwsparky]

I was thinking 2 with wood through the wheels, had a row with the mrs about it today though. I think she actually thought I was joking, I said I was going to view with intention to buy and she flipped! I had a bad off 23 years ago when I was very young and foolish and she's convinced it will happen again! I've been to the bolldor on a bike since then albeit before we had kids but I know how careful I'd be and how limited my usage would be....
Gona be a nice atmosphere in our house tonight:scratch:...

[Dirty]

Forgiveness is always easier to get than permission :)

[Nwsparky]

Forgiveness is always easier to get than permission :)

They are wise words, the bike I was looking at has now gone! These bikes go in a flash!:look:
I think I'll try the sulky routine for a bit, hopefully she'll give in as a 750 pops up somewhere..?

[utopia]

Dirty ...I like your style.

One thing about having had a bad off in the past, is that it rams home the importance of defensive roadcraft and anticipation. But I daresay you've already pointed that out.
The other thing is that monsters, with their torquey power characteristics and relatively gentle top end don't exactly encourage irresponsible riding ...and furthermore, while the 750 does have enough power to do most jobs well, it doesn't have the crazy excess of most other biggish bikes. And being a naked, you're not going to be wanting to go that quick on fast roads anyway.

Is any of that likely to help ?
You can quote me if you like.

[Nwsparky]

Utopia, I hear you!
I've been through this with her, my eldest was always dead against so I haven't bothered but it must be cool to have a biker dad now because she really wants me to get one! I'm an electrician that works in dangerous places everyday! I could ski, scooba dive, play rugby, rock climb etc....as you say being a biker having tasted hospital food does make you careful. She sees the hooners fly past our house at ridiculous speeds and thinks all bikers are the same I think! She actually said get a scooter they're safer! 80mph with less weight, grip or power/braking force isn't any safer atall, they just look less likely to let you get carried away!
My Megablade was about 18inches of the floor so was very hard to see coming but I survived that which was ridiculously quick and nimble.....
It doesn't help most if not all our friends neighbours I've mentioned it too have also tried to discourage me, I'm just going to have to put a proper argument together or use Dirty's system. Life's too short to put things off...
I need to be quick while the suns out!

[tricky73]

Just do what i did I brought my first big bike and took it home and said do you like my Toy she said no we had an argument job done she got over it. too late when its brought and paid for. not like i would cause a divorce they know where there bread is buttered

[Nwsparky]

Just do what i did I brought my first big bike and took it home and said do you like my Toy she said no we had an argument job done she got over it. too late when its brought and paid for. not like i would cause a divorce they know where there bread is buttered

I like your style, I've done it with cars, she never actually new what I paid for my Westy! Just rather have her blessing for some reason, I've not timed it well it's that women only psychotic time of the month in our house this week, silly me! A couple have popped up today, one went in hours but there's 2 others I'd buy now and just get delivered, I could keep one at my m8s garage she'd never know but I can't be bothered with sneakin about....
Ill just have a grown up chat with her when she gets back to normal....:Furious:

[Dirty]

Reminds me of a mate who had various nice motors, M3, Porsches, Range Rover etc and always underplayed how much they cost. He went ballistic one day when he found out his wife had spent nearly £1500 on a handbag. During the blazing row it came out she'd always known roughly what the motors had cost and over the years had spent roughly the difference on shoes and handbags.

They laugh about it now. 3 young kids later they drive a Ford people wagon and wear sensible shoes. That said he told me the other day he'd nearly fainted when he found out she'd spent £600 on a set of 3 saucepans. This was during the same conversation where he was telling me about his plans to buy a powered paraglider on the sly! Plus ca change! :)

[Fatal]

Nwsparky, just been through the same scenario with my misses, Like you I had a accident around 7 years ago, leaving me with floppy wrists:cry:, like a pratt promised never to have another bike. (regretted saying it the next day)
Last month the urge for another bike just got to strong and I broached the subject, She went ballistic, left it a week, she only just hit the roof, left it another week and she wasn't happy but asked the Daughter what she thought, little angel said she didn't want me to have one:banghead::banghead: (could of killed her):cry::cry:
After another week of me dragging my bottom lip on the floor She out of nowhere just said, if you want a bike get one.
Within 24 hours and 400miles of travel looking at Monsters, the deal was done, before she could change her mind:mand::mand:
Bought a S2R 800, love it to bits

Alan H

[Nwsparky]

I think your right Fatal, a wearing down process is required, I'm already fed up with my own sulking:chuckle:
I was going to mention it again when she just got in but the look on her face was enough to know it wasn't a good time! She was ranting about being skint and payday being a long way off and the car needs fuel blah, blah...she snapped at me, I snapped back, no chance......
She just went out with the kids saying she had no money for fuel so I threw her £40, she lit up and kissed me:rolleyes:
Perseverance and bribery will win her over, she's just a women....:mand:

[utopia]

..... I'm already fed up with my own sulking:chuckle:


Had to chuckle at that myself.

On the money front, I reckon that if you buy a aircooled 2-valver for under £2k, its never going to depreciate much and may even start to accumulate before long.
I paid £2600 for my yr2000 M750 about 6yrs ago. I doubt if its depreciated by £1k in that time, and its value has been stable now for a couple of years.
So its like money in the bank and a free bike to ride.
Servicing is an easy diy job for most operations, despite what myth would have you believe.

[Wildfire]

Dirty ...I like your style.

One thing about having had a bad off in the past, is that it rams home the importance of defensive roadcraft and anticipation. But I daresay you've already pointed that out.
The other thing is that monsters, with their torquey power characteristics and relatively gentle top end don't exactly encourage irresponsible riding ...and furthermore, while the 750 does have enough power to do most jobs well, it doesn't have the crazy excess of most other biggish bikes. And being a naked, you're not going to be wanting to go that quick on fast roads anyway.

Is any of that likely to help ?
You can quote me if you like.

Very wise words from Utopia there. I ride a ZX6-R as well and the smooth, zingy motor always begs to be revved. 4-6k on a 2V Monster is a great place to be, torquey, and you can hear the engine going, you know you have a bit more, but only if you feed it. On a IL4 you're just getting going, suddenly you're at 10k looking for the next 6 thousand revs.

The lack of fairing is also a big one. The wind makes you feel like you're going faster and it's also a bit tiring at silly speeds. Aim for a 600 and you'll never really hit epic speeds. I cruised along the other day around 70-ish quite comfortably. On my Ninja, this was considerably more just because the fairing re-directed the wind over me.

[Nwsparky]

I've ridden a m8s ZX6-R a while back and it was as you say very eager to have you suck the Tarmac up at naughty speeds!
Things have calmed down in the house and were talking nicely again so I'm going to bring up the subject again shortly, I am going to carefully explain my choice of bike and indeed if its a 6 then many are even described as beginners bikes, she is probably imagining im going to arrive home on an R6 and go off thrashing to wales every weekend, she knows I can ride, she knows ill only get chance to use it sparingly and she knows I don't give up, she just needs to understand why I want to get back in the saddle and know ill do it sensibly.....
Till I upgrade:chuckle:

[Blah blah]

...The other thing is that monsters, with their torquey power characteristics and relatively gentle top end don't exactly encourage irresponsible riding ...

No-one told me that :look: Does that mean I shouldn't be getting to the edge of my tyres and giving it a handful to ride the waves and waves of lovely torque??? Do I have to give it back now??? :mand:

An early 600/750 in reasonable condition will start at around £1000-1500, and the 750s have enough poke to keep you happy (never ridden a 600 so don't know), cans and a dynojet (stage 2) make it even better.

There's a bit of a 600 fixer down here in the paper for £1000, but it is in west Cornwall...

[Nwsparky]

Thanks blah, there's a few 600s about in need of tlc for little money. Just what I want, catch the end of the summer, do it up over winter and px for a 900 next year, she'll never know!
I had a gpz600 back in 2000 must have been F reg or something, I did get bored of its lack of grunt on the motorway pretty quick but I bought that to commute. I'd be happy to potter about this summer, build up mine and the wife's confidence then upgrade next year...
Nb. any excuse to go to west Cornwall is a good one though, lived down there for a year back in 96...

[Geoff Ives]

I would have liked to come in on this subject earlier but was away sunning myself in the Isle of Man with my favourite bike.... A M750 Monster.

I have owned and still owned quite a few Ducatis but my all time favorite is the 750 Monster... Why?
It encourages quick but responsible riding, it is user friendly in town and on rural roads.

I took mine together with my 600SS to 'the Island' and didn't use the Supersport, I was enjoying the M750 too much. On some of the Manx back roads that I love to explore it is perfect and even on the T.T course it is just fine. Don't expect to keep up with a Fiteblade, you won't but you will enjoy a different riding experience.

I went for a M750 because the 900 was too tall and too jerky in town while the M600 just wasn't powerfull enough.

You might have too look hard for a good 750 but it is worth the wait. Pay a little extra for a better machine and you may be making one of the best decisions of you morotcycle career.

Good Luck,
Geoff

[Nwsparky]

Cheers Geoff, sounds fantastic. I've just tried the bribary card, ive spent the weekend tree pruning and offered her some new running shoes, it went down well!:thumbsup:
I've stressed that what I want is basically a slow learners bike popular with women and something of an investment, she seemed to accept that. I think I will go for a 600 in need of cosmetic tlc it will break me back in gently and give me some grounding tinkering wise over winter, ill start looking for some good cheap leathers and boots too....:on:....:D

[Fatal]

Cheers Geoff, sounds fantastic. I've just tried the bribary card, ive spent the weekend tree pruning and offered her some new running shoes, it went down well!:thumbsup:
I've stressed that what I want is basically a slow learners bike popular with women and something of an investment, she seemed to accept that. I think I will go for a 600 in need of cosmetic tlc it will break me back in gently and give me some grounding tinkering wise over winter, ill start looking for some good cheap leathers and boots too....:on:....:D

The running shoes is a good idea, if she runs 10 miles a day, then next week she'l be to far away, to know you've bought the bike of your dreams:mand::mand::mand:

Alan H

[Nwsparky]

:mand::thumbsup:

[Nwsparky]

We're there many advances in the 600 to the 620 from 99-2004/5?
Is the rev counter and extra brake disc worth another £1000?....
Is the 620 any quicker?....

[Black Bob]

The other thing is that monsters, with their torquey power characteristics and relatively gentle top end don't exactly encourage irresponsible riding ...and furthermore, while the 750 does have enough power to do most jobs well, it doesn't have the crazy excess of most other biggish bikes. And being a naked, you're not going to be wanting to go that quick on fast roads anyway....

In the nicest possible way, I couldn't disagree more. :D

I have not come across a bike that more encourages a "ride it like you stole it" attitude than the Monster and, possibly, the smaller capacity ones are more guilty than the bigger ones. Not tried a 600, but have taken both the 620 and 750 round the best twisties that my part of the country has to offer, and they just love to be caned and thrown around corners. (And jumped over hump-backed bridges, ahem.)

Therefore, they're just as capable of getting you into trouble as anything else. Anything with a decent chassis and at least 50 bhp falls into that category.

However, I suspect what Utopia was really getting at, is that you'll get a rewarding riding experience at more sensible speeds that you just wouldn't get from, say, a 600cc inline 4. If that kind of experience is what you are after, then any sized Monster is a great choice. Just don't get a small one on the pretence that it'll make you more sensible than a larger engined one would - you'll just end up thrashing the smaller one more.

Nwsparky, again in the nicest possible way... you sound like you want a bike with every fibre of your being. So, if you have the pecuniary means and you are not making your family go short as a result, then my advice is to end all this fannying around, buttering up the wife, etc. and just get the bike you really want, and ride it as much as your heart desires. Your life is ending one second at a time. If you wish to placate the wife, then promise her you will get some advanced training and wear sensible clothing.

That should be enough, frankly.

Good luck.

[Nwsparky]

Your absoloutely right Bob time to put up or shut up, got a 620 to view this week...

[Dirty]

600's have carbs, 620's are injected

[Nwsparky]

Well money put where mouth is today! Put a deposit on a gorgeous 620i.e 6kmiles, just serviced, full history and all keys...carbon bits, sil moto exhausts and immaculate!
Missed out on an tatty 600 by £20 yesterday on eBay, I'm so glad I did now!
Pics when I get it home , next week sometime...can't wait!
I wonder what the wife will say....

[Nwsparky]

Well money put where mouth is today! Put a deposit on a gorgeous 620i.e 6kmiles, just serviced, full history and all keys...carbon bits, sil moto exhausts and immaculate!
Missed out on an tatty 600 by £20 yesterday on eBay, I'm so glad I did now!
Pics when I get it home , next week sometime...can't wait!
I wonder what the wife will say....

[Fatal]

Nice one, looking forward to the photo's

Alan H

[Dirty]

Excellent! Yes pics please

[Nwsparky]

I notice some yellow avatars, it is also yellow, the first I've seen advertised, he's sending some pics up today, wife was actually pretty cool, as someone said 'forgiveness far easier to obtain than permission'....

[Nwsparky]

Quick shot http://i770.photobucket.com/albums/xx350/smigga46/93962F49-92A7-4F6A-AAA2-9C87CF1030DA-499-000000D200D806AC_zps57c3a6fd.jpg

[Dirty]

Oh very nice! You'll be fine as long as you don't mention you bought the fastest colour :)

[Mr Gazza]

Congratulations and welcome Nwsparky....I hope you will be very happy together.:D

[Nwsparky]

Thanks, well keep the fastest colour between us!
Got to wait till next Friday! Time to find a nice lid!

[tricky73]

Nice one hope you enjoy your ride

[Nwsparky]

6 sleeps to go! Courier booked, leathers bought, boots bought, body armour being watched on eBay....
Not excited atall!....honest....

[Fatal]

Nice, by far the best colour:):)

Alan H

[Geoff Ives]

Oh very nice! You'll be fine as long as you don't mention you bought the fastest colour :)

Isn't Yellow the colour that they reccommend for learners and inexperienced riders?...:mand:

[Fatal]

Isn't Yellow the colour that they reccommend for learners and inexperienced riders?...:mand:
Sounds about right:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[utopia]

That looks really nice.
Nice cans, two discs at the front, the lighter 3-spoke wheels, later type clutch with external master cyl, rev counter, the right bellypan, nice frame colour, carbon front mudguard, belt covers with inspection windows, screen, and no carbs to ice up in the autumn damp.
Job's a good-un, I'd say.
Could perhaps do with a smaller plate. ..I found that you can trim the borders of a std plate within a few mm of the letters and get the size pretty much down to 8x6, without it looking at all likely to get you pulled. (see rear pic of my bike arriving at the Buell day at East Kirkby yesterday).
Maybe bar end mirrors too ...I found that 75mm round ones actually give a better view than the std mickey mouse mirrors. ...and really cheap, but very decent Chinese ones can be had on ebay these days (though black anodising may fade due to low quality dyes, so I'd go for titanium grey or silver).
....a couple of easy mods for you to pamper your new monster with.

As for colour, I couldn't decide whether yellow or red was the fastest, so my bike is orange.
Mind you, I have a sneaky suspicion that the fastest colour is actually black !!

[Nwsparky]

Thanks sorry I don't have better pics yet!
Owner tells me that if doesn't run with thd side stand down as a safety feature? Is this true? Can you not let it run to warm on the side stand then? I'd have thought it would just cut out in 1st?

[stormlet]

No, it won't start with the side stand down as I found out a couple of weeks ago when I bought my 750 - we are thinking of bypassing this particular feature as it is a bit of a pain - I assume that most folk end up doing it!

[Nwsparky]

Yes bit of a faf that, could be 1st mod!

[utopia]

I disconnected/bypassed my sidestand switch a couple of years ago, and intended to buy one of the conversion kits (TPO ?) that link it to the neutral switch, so you can start the engine with the sidestand down, but only if its not in gear.
I never got round to it though and, like an idiot, a couple of months ago I ended up thumbing the starter while standing next to the bike, while it was in gear.
The bike jumped off the sidestand, fell sideways on a lamppost before I could catch it, and dented the tank.
So I wouldn't recommend just bypassing the cutout and relying on memory.
I now have a homemade mod which involves just 12 ins of wire, a bullet connector if you're being fussy, and a diode, which does the job.
I only did it a short while ago though, and since then I've had an electrical glitch which melted the alternator/reg.rec connector block. Its almost guaranteed that this is completely unrelated to the diode mod, but I'll give it a few weeks running with the glitch repaired (alternator is now hard-wired to the reg/rec ) before I post details, as electrics isn't my hot subject and I would hate to risk causing your electrics to melt too, despite that being unlikely.
The mod is dead easy to do though, and super neat as well as cheap.
Mind you, my monster is a carby, so I've got no expensive electronics to risk by an amateur mod like this. Again, I think that's unlikely, but I'm not really qualified to state that for certain.
Anyway, I'll post it up in a few weeks, once its been fully road tested.

[bluestoesonnose]

Just a thought if you're short in the leg just get the saddle cut, had 20mm taken out of the M750 saddle and the 5'3" GF (short legged) can touch the floor no issues. Haven't bothered with anything else as I didn't want to upset the handling.

I've got a lowered saddle (20mm again) for the S4R and she can get the balls of both feet down. I will drop the forks and put a shorter link in it once she takes it on full time.

[utopia]

On the same lowering theme, I've recently been wondering whether its possible to lower a monster with hoop type suspension linkage by replacing the locknuts on the rose joints with thinner ones, ie normal thickness for locknuts rather than the thicker std nuts that Ducati use.
I can't see it compromising the system in any way and it may allow you to screw the rose joints in by a further turn. This won't lower it much of course, but it might be the little bit that makes all the difference, and it would cost virtually nothing and be a whole lot simpler to do than getting the hoop shortened.

Incidentally, while I'm on the subject, its worth checking those rose joints on a newly acquired monster as they are prone to seizing.
Bounce the rear suspension and listen for squeaks. Then spray with wd40 or similar (I prefer gt85) and see if its any quieter. If so, remove and regrease or replace the rose joints.

[Nwsparky]

Still 2 sleeps to go but I've managed to sort another picture!
http://i770.photobucket.com/albums/xx350/smigga46/null_zps3692f31f.jpg

I say sleep, not seemed to be able to get much this week!

[wurzel]

I disconnected/bypassed my sidestand switch a couple of years ago, and intended to buy one of the conversion kits (TPO ?) that link it to the neutral switch, so you can start the engine with the sidestand down, but only if its not in gear.
I never got round to it though and, like an idiot, a couple of months ago I ended up thumbing the starter while standing next to the bike, while it was in gear.
The bike jumped off the sidestand, fell sideways on a lamppost before I could catch it, and dented the tank.
So I wouldn't recommend just bypassing the cutout and relying on memory.
I now have a homemade mod which involves just 12 ins of wire, a bullet connector if you're being fussy, and a diode, which does the job.
I only did it a short while ago though, and since then I've had an electrical glitch which melted the alternator/reg.rec connector block. Its almost guaranteed that this is completely unrelated to the diode mod, but I'll give it a few weeks running with the glitch repaired (alternator is now hard-wired to the reg/rec ) before I post details, as electrics isn't my hot subject and I would hate to risk causing your electrics to melt too, despite that being unlikely.
The mod is dead easy to do though, and super neat as well as cheap.
Mind you, my monster is a carby, so I've got no expensive electronics to risk by an amateur mod like this. Again, I think that's unlikely, but I'm not really qualified to state that for certain.
Anyway, I'll post it up in a few weeks, once its been fully road tested.

I have been told that when the bike is on the side stand, and if the engine was running, the engine oil is not distributed correctly and may cause problems. Not sure if this is true..?

[Dirty]

I have been told that when the bike is on the side stand, and if the engine was running, the engine oil is not distributed correctly and may cause problems. Not sure if this is true..?

I'm no expert but wouldn't that mean bendy roads / tracks would do the same?

[Nwsparky]

I'm no expert but wouldn't that mean bendy roads / tracks would do the same?

I would think a long sweeping left would indeed be the same....?