Ducati 1199 Panigale not in WSBK until 2013

[SunEye]

Today Ducati announced the name of their new superbike. The 1199 Panigale.

What I found more interesting was this

Developed as a true sport bike with competition in its DNA, the Ducati 1199 Panigale will first see racing action in the 2012 FIM Superstock Championship and, in accordance with the factory’s development program, make its debut in World Superbike in 2013.

It's interesting that they've had Troy Bayliss working on the bike's development (I assume as a race bike) which most people thought would mean a 2012 WSBK entry, but no they're waiting for something or is that someone?

I've been saying since Valentino Rossi joined Ducati's MotoGP team that he would ride for two years in MotoGP and then go to WSBK in 2013. The fact that their brand new superbike doesn't go to WSBK until 2013 says to me that Valentino will be the first to race it in WSBK.

In 2012 can Valentino spend as much time as he likes riding a WSBK race spec 1199 without contravening any testing rules because it's not a current WSBK bike and he's not a current WSBK rider? If so then if he doesn't win WSBK in 2013 then there is something seriously wrong somewhere.

[Mr.Number]

He's 32. Rossi wont leave moto gp until he takes the kings crown from Agostini. That requires 2 more championships...........and they will be with ducati.

[Kato]

Ago will remain the greatest ever............Rossi hasn't got a podium in him let alone another championship.

with Hayden, RDP and Karel Abraham out qualifying him on the same bike, you know the one he says is no good surely proves what a waste of space he is.

[Mr.Number]

Hmm.........

[SunEye]

I think that time is running out for Rossi in MotoGP. Agostini only raced for 13 years. Rossi is already in his 15th year. Things were very different in Agostini's day. He was racing 350cc and 500cc at the same meeting with no more than 13 meetings in a year. In some years there were as few as 7 races in some of the classes.

I'm sure Rossi would love 9 500cc/MotoGP world championships, but it isn't going to happen. He could go to WSBK and clean up for quite a few years. 5 WSBK championships for Ducati? We know he always has his eye on the stats. If he can't win in MotoGP anymore, and that looks increasingly likely, WSBK looks like the best place for him to go. Ducati's business is selling bikes and they need Rossi winning in order to sell bikes and at the moment WSBK looks like the best way to achieve that. It also means that they can market the bike they're selling as the bike that Rossi rides. They can't do that with a MotoGP bike. Rossi's MotoGP contract with Ducati is for 2 years. If next year is great and he wins the championship I think he'll leave on a high and go to WSBK as current MotoGP champion to win back to back MotoGP and WSBK titles (because nobody has ever done that). If next year is as bad as this year he'll go to WSBK to prove that he can still win, much like Max Biaggi, Marco Melandri and Carlos Checa have.

[rac3r]

Ducati says: "The two-stage introduction enables Ducati additional development for the Superbike version of the 1199 Panigale, appropriate to the more open regulations of the World Superbike category, and in addition help control costs for World Superbike teams who can continue to compete with a 2012 version of the 1198 with technical support from Ducati Engineers."

http://www.ultimatemotorcycling.com/2011/the-names-official-ducati-1199-panigale

Rossi said recently that after a while he'd like to try superbikes and then when he's old he wants to drive rally cars :chuckle:

The thing is I think WSBK seems to be dying out a little, really good riders end up moving to MotoGP and the oldies from MotoGP end up coming back. This season has been pretty boring whereas the Haga/Spies season was awesome!

Also the factory teams seem to be pulling out with hardly any left. Add to this the introduction of CRT teams in MotoGP it doesn't look too good for WSBK

[craigie]

I think that time is running out for Rossi in MotoGP. Agostini only raced for 13 years. Rossi is already in his 15th year. Things were very different in Agostini's day. He was racing 350cc and 500cc at the same meeting with no more than 13 meetings in a year. In some years there were as few as 7 races in some of the classes.

I'm sure Rossi would love 9 500cc/MotoGP world championships, but it isn't going to happen. He could go to WSBK and clean up for quite a few years. 5 WSBK championships for Ducati? We know he always has his eye on the stats. If he can't win in MotoGP anymore, and that looks increasingly likely, WSBK looks like the best place for him to go. Ducati's business is selling bikes and they need Rossi winning in order to sell bikes and at the moment WSBK looks like the best way to achieve that. It also means that they can market the bike they're selling as the bike that Rossi rides. They can't do that with a MotoGP bike. Rossi's MotoGP contract with Ducati is for 2 years. If next year is great and he wins the championship I think he'll leave on a high and go to WSBK as current MotoGP champion to win back to back MotoGP and WSBK titles (because nobody has ever done that). If next year is as bad as this year he'll go to WSBK to prove that he can still win, much like Max Biaggi, Marco Melandri and Carlos Checa have.

I think if he has another bad year then there will be no way that he will want to ride a duc with an alu stressed airbox instead of a frame no matter how many cylinders it has.

According to the weekly rag the new bike is not good at corner entry and this is why there is delay in the SBKness , who knows how true that may be though.

[Mr.Number]

Early days to be stating where Rossi will be going.

Whether moto gp is enjoyable or not, it is the biggest motorcycling racing event in the world. This is where the manufacturers want to see their bikes, regularly on the podiums, especially come the seasons end.

Rossi is 2 championships away from being the number one gp rider of all time. Wouldnt you want that crown in his position. You think its out of reach ????? 32 in my opinion does not fall under the 'past it' category. Far from it. Yes ducati have got it to do, but its do-able.

When we rumble up to 1000cc next year, if ducati have 'sorted' the bike, as in frame and front end feedback rossi/ducati willl pack a powerful punch for flakey moaner. But to achieve that I think ducati need to go back to the drawing board with the ergonomics of the engine layout. As it is now, its ****ed up the front end and needs to be sitting further back. Its this thats causing the bike to be slower when changing direction.

The front end and frame issue wont be resolved this year and Rossi apparently has stated hes no engineer and its down to ducati now which could be viewed as a sort of 'washing my hands of it' type of comment. Things are obviously bad at the moment as iv not heard rossi come out with anything like this since riding the bike, so it must be getting to him. But hes not cried yet like moaner.

Iv just come back from the Aragon gp and the power the bike is creating is awesome, as you know rossi started at the back having used his engine allowance for the season, but the progress he was making was down to power which was really noticeable on the straights where it looked the quickest of them all.

I dont wonder just how far ducati are from getting it right, rather how close, im more for the feeling its just a couple of re-design matters, which if resolved hand in hand with the 1000 engine, it could be an explosive 2012.

[craigie]

But hes not cried yet like moaner.

He may have 'cried' but at least he could win on it.

[Mr Cake]

Not cried!!!??? Flippin eck!

He left a team because his team mates were getting equal equipment, refused to allow the team to sign a young rider, threatened to leave the sport of he didn't get a certain piece of equipment, refused to share data with his team mate and left that team because they wouldn't get rid of the current world champion. Now that's crying like a good'un!

VR to WSB? No chance. Racing production motorcycles? Not his style.

Ago the greatest ever? The results would have you believe so, but for alot of the time he was competing in three races per meeting on much more superior machinery than his rivals, winning races by minutes. I just don't buy into the whole Agostini fascination.

C

[benson]

I'm liking your words Mr Cake....

[rac3r]

I think they're all rubbish and I'm the best!

These are arguments just go round in circles, look at the one I started on Ducatisti :chuckle:

[Mr.Number]

I actually see rossi in wsbk, just not as soon as others.

They all moan at some point, iv just not seen rossi do it with the ducati team yet.

[SunEye]

Casey Stoner is fairly open and honest with his opinions. Even if he won he'll have been thinking about all the things that aren't quite right with the bike whilst he was riding it. If you stick a mic in front of him after a race he'll give you the rider's view of it which will be all the things that weren't right.

Rossi tends to keep those thoughts for his engineers. He doesn't want to tell the world what weaknesses the bike has even if he's winning by a country mile.

I think that Rossi would dearly love to see out his MotoGP career with Ducati, preferably winning races and championships. Publicly he won't rock the Ducati boat because for now it won't achieve anything. However I doubt that he is anything like as diplomatic behind closed doors.

[rac3r]

WSBK will be going to Russia next year

http://www.worldsbk.com/en/news/5-news/8861-agreement-signed-in-rome-to-bring-fim-superbike-world-championship-to-russia-in-2012-.html

[rac3r]

Someone has posted the specs on Ducatisti which were released by pro italia.....195 bhp and 179kg wet

Here is a comparison with other superbikes

http://hellforleathermagazine.com/2011/09/ducati-1199-panigale-vs-the-superbike-competition/

[SunEye]

As far as making a race winning WSBK bike Ducati seem to know a thing or two. 51.7% race wins and 56.5% championship wins.

Every time they race a new model [888, 916, 996, 999, 1098] it wins the championship with the exception of the 998 in 2002 which lost by one point and despite Troy Bayliss winning 14 races compared to Colin Edwards 11 on the Honda SP2.

I'd put money on the 1199 winning WSBK in 2013 whoever is riding it.

[Gilps]

Someone has posted the specs on Ducatisti which were released by pro italia.....195 bhp and 179kg wet

Here is a comparison with other superbikes

http://hellforleathermagazine.com/2011/09/ducati-1199-panigale-vs-the-superbike-competition/

Are those figures for the stock bike or the R, coz if that's the stock bike and the R will make more bhp then maybe it's time for the other manufacturers to start petitioning for twins to be reduced to 1000cc again in line with all other engines. I think the 1200 cc rule is wrong.

[Mr Cake]

Here here, Paul.

Dave

[rac3r]

Are those figures for the stock bike or the R, coz if that's the stock bike and the R will make more bhp then maybe it's time for the other manufacturers to start petitioning for twins to be reduced to 1000cc again in line with all other engines. I think the 1200 cc rule is wrong.

stock bike