Plastic Tank Problem

[rac3r]

OK so I'm sure you've all read about the problems in the US forums and it seems mine has developed the same problem. It has:

1 - Bubbles in the paint work
2 - Right hand rubber mount doesn't sit properly on the frame
3 - It's sits too tight around the key shroud so much so that you have to remove the shroud to undo the latch
4 - Slight ripples where your knees go

So I think it might be an idea to see if Ducati would do something about it. I want to ask should I go through a Dealer or write to Ducati UK?

I know my chances are slim but it's worth a shot!

[Funkatronic]

The basis of the class action law suit in the US was that the tank was not fit for purpose as E10 (ethenol added) fuel was widely on sale in the US back in 2005/06 when ducati started importing plastic tanks there

E10 hasnt come into use in the UK yet (although apparently the "Fuel Save" addatives in some UK fueals are related ) but tehy have started using E10 in germany

in order to get them to replace the tank you will probabably would have to prove to ducati the tank is unfit for purpose. the US class action suit is in your favour but you still might have to get a bunch of people together with a similar problem over here before ducati will issue a recall. Have you heard much anecdoatel evidence from you Daytona contacts?
You caould try talking to trading standards too as they will be able to help you define and test if the tank is unfit for purpose
Give it a go but take some advice on how to word the letter first

NB i have not seen this on any of my plastic tanked bikes personally (YET! )

[rac3r]

Daytona didn't know anything about it until I told them and the owner was still convinced that my frame is 4mm shorter than all the other monsters for some reason! :chuckle:

TBH at the moment it's just an inconvenience of having to remove the shroud to undo the latch and the little bubbles don't look too good. Oh and the steering lock stop had to be adjusted on one side

I'll have to see what to do. While I'm here has anyone else had any symptoms?

[Funkatronic]

is your bracket where the frame meets the tank bent?

pegboys moved quite a bit in his pang prob cos he gripped it hard with his knees so it took his body weight forward

have a looks for his post, think theres pic of the bent bracket

Ray at rosso corse says he sees that often as that piece of metal is quite thin

[Funkatronic]

ducati's track record on recalls is not great, just look back at all the historical posts about the engine paint flaking debacle

[rac3r]

Yeah I was told that's a weak point but that's fine. The bike was in for service and at the time we were all really confused, the measured everything, checked for any signs of repaired damage etc. Even bought in another S2R to play spot the difference!

It's only when I got home and searched I found the US thread and the pictures matched what I had. I'm back there to have a C&S kit fitted so I'll see if they can do anything (although they are no longer a Duc dealer so I'm not sure)

[Funkatronic]

In that case Maybe your tank was bought 2nd hand from the states

Or maybe one of the previous owners cleaned the tank out with alcohol/ethanol

Come to think of it the s4r I saw the other night had quite a close fitting tank:idea:

Find out what's required for the recall in the states ie do they check the serial numbers of the bike to see if it's a us model? Will they need proof of ownership?

[rac3r]

I'll check it out and post back here if I make any progress :thumbsup:

[pooh]

Daft question is there any adjustment left on the rear mount as they have three bolts in slotted holes. May be worth a look.

Ian

[rac3r]

It's been put as far back as it can go, I've contacted them so let's see...

[rac3r]

Small update: contacted Ducati UK who said they are concerned as they've not heard of it in the UK yet so I have to go to a Dealer to have it inspected and what not

[Funkatronic]

maybe take it to someone sympathetic rather than metropolis

Pro Twins?

know its very out of your way but snells in Alton maybe?

[rac3r]

Daytona reckon they can still do it so I'll go there first

[Nickj]

E10 hasnt come into use in the UK yet (although apparently the "Fuel Save" addatives in some UK fueals are related ) but tehy have started using E10 in germany

The Tesco are selling an E5 brand of fuel marketed as 99 RON super-unleaded. I assume that it is also found in a lot of other fuels like Shell's V-Power (99 RON) and BP's Ultimate (97 RON).
Not as much ethanol so it would take longer to get the reaction.

[rac3r]

Another Small update: Dealer has taken pics and stuff and sent it off to Ducati so now to wait for them to respond...

In the meantime this looks like a good alternative if things go wrong http://www.ca-cycleworks.com/products/tanks/ca-cycleworks-4-3-gallon-tank-for-ducati-monster-s2r 150 miles between fill ups is nice :D

Even if Ducati replace it it seems they still swell up!

[jerry]

Yes the replacement tanks made by Acerbis are still no good and Ducati will not make steel tanks so the problem rumbles on in USA , some owners have had as many as 4 replacement tanks !!!!!!!!!!

The answer is for Ducati to bite the bullet and get steel tanks made , even though they would add 2kg to weight and cost more to make they are proven technology and Ethanol proof unlike plastic and Acerbis have tried 3 plastics formulas in production so far.

[steeevvvooo]

...taken from Ducatisti, but these guys apparently coat the inside of the tank for £150+vat. Probably not a good idea to mess around if you are trying to claim from Ducati, but if you get a new one, or for others worries about the expansion, it might be an option.

http://www.motorcyclerestorationcompany.com/

[rac3r]

Thanks for the link Steeevvvooo

[rac3r]

Got a reply back from Ducati UK which included this bit:

Your Ducati Monster S2R is the first of its kind in which we have seen any deformation in the fuel tank. We do not consider this a manufacturing defect so will not replace under warranty however, we would like to offer a new replacement tank at a heavily subsidised price of £581.91 including VAT. For your reference a new tank retails at £1163.82 including VAT. Alternatively we can make a request to all dealerships within the network to enquire about a second hand fuel tank on your behalf. A second hand fuel tank would also be at your cost and please note so would any labour for any fitment of any replacement tank as well.

:chuckle: Thanks for the help! :thumbsdown:

[slipperyweeguy]

Regardless of what is going on in the US, petrol tanks are not regarded as consumables in this country, requiring regular replacement. Interesting that the tank is recognzed as deformed, but no cause identified, and no interest in establishing cause.
UK consumers are protected by lots of legislation, and Funkatronic's advice in post 2 of this thread recommending a call to Trading Standards (a dept of your local Council) is well worth another read. You will want to have the vehicle details handy.
Certain officers specialise in motor trade issues, and can be very useful. Best of luck.

[rac3r]

Thing is I can't see it being worth the hassle as I'm the only one here with the problem so they're likely not to bother too much. In the use loads of them applied together

[Funkatronic]

i may know where to get a new red tank for £500 all inc

[rac3r]

I don't really need one yet but there are a few on ebay going for £150.

I also read that if you drain the tank and allow it to air out it shrinks back to normal size

[the_adam]

How much? :eyepopping: And if they don't consider it a manufacturing defect, does that mean they're all designed to do it? At £1100 a tank they could have a good earner there :idea:

You could actually get a small monster for less than that and take the tank off it... If it's not going to cause leaking or anything think I'd just get a tank cover to hide the visible problems (but then I really like mine, it never comes off! :D)

[rac3r]

TBH there isn't much visually, the main point is not being able to un-latch the tank and if it expands too much and starts leaking but so far so good

[jerry]

Ducati UK are a lying bunch of XXNts, the deformed tanks issue is Massive in USA over 25,000 cases reported and major court cases , also deformed tanks have been reported in Germany , Australia and Thailand and free replacements were issued under warranty even on bikes 5 years old . Do not let them fob you off i am certain that yours is not the first case in UK .I remember from DSC or was it Ducatisti forums that some 848 and 1098 owners had thsis issue and got replacements under warranty

Go to Trading standards mention the US problem look on US Ducati forums

[Funkatronic]

fwiw i wouldnt take no for an answer either

[rac3r]

Any suggestions on how to word the email back to them?

[steeevvvooo]

seem to recall the US case making the point that if it expands far enough, it's a safety issue because:

1) Could hinder range of steering

2) A deformed tank could make the bike unstable due to uneven load (especially during cornering)

3) Could leak/pierce causing a fuel leak, again, very dangerous

All pretty extreme, but possible...

[jerry]

Its a safety issue and not fit for purpose ,Trading standards are your first port of call for advice on appraoch to ducati UK ,,,if they insist that its not a problem ,and they claim not to know about all the issues in USA that an outright corporate lie they cant be that ignorant of what is happeneing within their own company.

[jerry]

Triumph UK stopped building bikes with plastic tanks in 2010 and reverted to steel due to ethanol causing problems with warping and degrading the tanks it was a safety issue as well.

[Funkatronic]

write another letter stressing the US case aagin, mentioning E5 is alraedy in use in this country and that E10 is coming so the problem is likely to get worse
could also point out E10 is available in germany, i doubt theres anything oin the terms of sale that say the bike cannot be ridden and used there regularly (althiugh migt be worth finding a lawyer to check this

ask about it on other uk and european ducati forums to see if there is any other take up on this,
quck google found this (http://www.ducatisti.co.uk/forum/ducati-chat/45851-petrol-staining-tank-tank-expanding.html), so theres prob more

talk to trading standards, try and get a donor tank and get it tested by TS (this might cost mind but if you can find others with the same issue to chip in) if it can be proven its unfit for purpose ducati will be forced ino a recall and tyou cn charge them the costs which is why getting others together will help

long shot but see if you can find a young bike friendny consumer rights/commercial lawyer lookng to make a name for themselves and see if they will take the case on pro bono

try not to put Ducati out of business tho please ;-)

[jerry]

Ducati are doing their best to put themselves out of business by denying the problem especially in USA where out of court settlements are being made on individual cases and Ducati North America are by policy sending out refurbed Plastic tanks all the time in order to avoid a real but probably ineveitable clash in court to force Ducati to make steel replacements at a HUGE financila cost .The customers do not want the plastic tanks replaced time and time again they want a cure my friend greg in Sacramento has ha 4 replacement tanks on his 2008 Hypermotard all fail due to plastic being eaten inside by Ethanol /water he has contributed $1000 to a class action involving 1800 + owners suing Ducati for a cure not patch ups ....this will end in tears .