Protective Gear - The Right To Choose

[Desmondo]

Saw a letter in this weeks MCN ranting about people who go out on bikes in the summer without protective gear. When I go to Europe and the States ordinary clothing on bikers often seems to be the norm. Although wearing proper gear is obviously safer should we really criticise those who are prepared to take the risk? For some people biking is about risk, freedom image and just getting on and riding. Are we in danger of becoming part of the conservative and risk averse culture that have led to speed cameras, road humps etc. that so many of us dislike? Views?

Desmondo

[Richard_S]

its true, personal choice is the key. I was very tempted to go al fresco on my recent jaunt to the US of A but as it turned out I spent the fortnight getting drunk and canoodling in lakes. As you say though everyone was in shorts and flip flops.
I spent a few days on the Cap D'age in the S of F and rode Charlotte around the site starkers. Its fun but highly dangerous, pay your money take your choice etc.



ps it is a nudist resort btw, although it would have been better in a straight part of town. However even I have a level of restraint.

[Desmondo]

Be careful with those underseat exhausts :)

Have to admit that shorts, T Shirt and no lid often work for me when abroad (when in Rome and all that) but strangely I revert to wearing gear back at home. Bit strange really given the risk, roads and medical care are often a lot worse in other parts of the world. Be interesting to know how their accident rates etc. compare.

Desmondo

[spacemonkey]

I ride my mountain bike at around 25-30mph around town and I wouldn't dream of wearing more than shorts and Tshirt, so why should I wear a body armour suit to do the same speeds around town on a motorbike? Incidentally, I wear fullleathers up to about 27 deg then jeans and leather jacket, but that's cos I fly around way over the limit.... However, if it was a sub 30mph jaunt, then i can't see the harm. Choices, choices...

[JMo]

I ride my mountain bike at around 25-30mph around town

Flippin'eck - those are some legs you've got there matey - or else some fancy gearing on your 'cicle x

I know what you mean though - I often wear my jeans if I'm not out for a hoon... but I would always wear gloves, even on the pushbike...

xxx

[bod]

Full leathers whatever the temperature.....warm conditions dont stop the skin peeeling of your body if you fall off(know matter who was at fault for the off)!
Saw a bloke on a harley tonking it down my local (if tonking is the expresion)road YEH he looked cool but what if?
Only take one car to pull out in front of you :eek:

[MilesB]

Have to admit that shorts, T Shirt and no lid often work for me when abroad (when in Rome and all that) but strangely I revert to wearing gear back at home. Bit strange really given the risk, roads and medical care are often a lot worse in other parts of the world. Be interesting to know how their accident rates etc. compare.
Desmondo
To quote from the Comic's website:
August 9 2005
Lid ban = more deaths
Deaths on bikes have risen 81 per cent in Florida in the three years since the state repealed its helmet law.
Deaths of riders under 21 nearly tripled, according to a National Highway Traffic Safety Administration study. Head-injury hospital admissions rose 80 percent in the same period.

There you go, a proper scientific study paid for by the people of Florida :eek:

Miles

[birchie]

I must admit the sight of people in shorts n t shirts ridin along does make me cringe, and god help em if they come a cropper, but they do so at their own risk n choice.

This is surely the whole point of living and riding bikes in the first place we want freedom we want that escape from being told constantly what we can and cannot do all the time by the do gooders.

[jill]

I do agree that everyone should have the right to choose. However, I think riding a bike is reckless enough without adding to the danger of when (not if) you fall off. If you're sensible enough to wear a helmet, why wouldn't you wear other protective gear? (If it's very hot, I wear those 'Draggin Jeans' - they look like jeans but have some good slide protection.)

jill

[nik_the_brief]

Full leathers whatever the temperature.....warm conditions dont stop the skin peeeling of your body if you fall off(know matter who was at fault for the off)!
Saw a bloke on a harley tonking it down my local (if tonking is the expresion)road YEH he looked cool but what if?
Only take one car to pull out in front of you :eek:

I'm with you on this one Bod - well that's my personal choice anyway, I have no problem with others wearing what they feel comfortable in (despite cringing on the inside when I see the flip flop and shorts brigade - generally on Gixxers or CBRs).

Leathers might be hot in the summer but they're the best protection available and they always look cool. After all isn't one of the reasons for getting a bike just an excuse to wear black leather and look cool and menacing (without paying the extortionate entrance fees for Torture Garden!). Oh and the number of generous offers to help you out of those hot leathers from nice young ladies is always a great ego boost!

I remember sliding down the road on my arris when I was learning on my old 125 (getting overconfident with my emergency stops on a crappy road surface) and despite my leathers I had a very painful burn for days. I was ony going slowly and shudder to think of how nasty it would've been had I been wearing something less substantial.

A friend of mine's 13 year old son came off his mountain bike yesterday after playing silly buggers. He's broken his right clavicle, his left wrist and is covered in bruises and burns from sliding down the tarmac. I'm not saying that he should've been wearing leathers or owt but it does show the damage that can be done at a comparatively slow speed.

[Lost Again]

Going to have to go down the semi sensible route on this one. I fell off my 400 twice writing it off the second time. Both times were at a good 80- 85, bit of a tank slapper followed by a*se to tarmac. Was wearing jeans and jacket on first one, was in hospital every other day for 6 weeks to get dressings changed and couldn't walk without crutches for a week or 2 after that. Second off I was wearing full leathers. Sprained my ankle and had a bit of a hobble for a week or 2. Made a huge difference, which is why now if I'm just bimbling round locally I wear jeans but always with jacket gloves and boots. Out for a hoon tho its gotta be full leathers.

And so ends my wandering story for today.....

[DesmoDog]

It's an old chestnut this one isn't it? I think the rider should choose. If I don't wear a lid, I die - no-one else. End of argument. Incidentally, if you ride without a lid in almost any country in Europe you'll get nicked. Some locals choose to ignore the law, and I've seen local police on Santorini let locals through then flag down the obvious tourist on the 125 for not wearing a lid. But it's deffo against the law in most states.

[JMo]

A friend of mine's 13 year old son came off his mountain bike yesterday after playing silly buggers. He's broken his right clavicle, his left wrist and is covered in bruises and burns from sliding down the tarmac. I'm not saying that he should've been wearing leathers or owt but it does show the damage that can be done at a comparatively slow speed.

I recall my riding instuctor said that at 30mph, it takes just four inches (that's less than a palm length) to remove the skin down to the bone on your hands - that's why gloves really are essential, even on a pushbike... as it is a natural instinct to put your hand out to try and protect yourself...

xxx

ps. You should get yourself of the TG guest list Nik - far easier x

[The Kevlar Kid]

Haven't we been here before?????

I'm not even going to comment this time - I believe I was reffered to as an idiot last time :D

[skunk43]

I was over in South Africa at easter and took my fully armoured kit with me, wore it once on my brother in laws zx9 and nearly died :mad: of heat exhaustion. every time I stopped at the lights the heat build up was instant.
there after jeans and t shirt. ALWAYS gloves,boots and helmet.

[mark cross]

[QUOTE=The Kevlar Kid]Haven't we been here before?????

agree, wear what you want. whats thw problem :confused:

[CK & AK]

Haven't we been here before?????


astute chap :D

only a month ago was the last thread - but its a common discussion, which there is lots of noisy debating over - probably about twice a year here.....

http://www.ukmonster.co.uk/monster/showthread.php?t=12997&highlight=jacket

[spacemonkey]

Flippin'eck - those are some legs you've got there matey - or else some fancy gearing on your 'cicle x

I know what you mean though - I often wear my jeans if I'm not out for a hoon... but I would always wear gloves, even on the pushbike...

xxx

They may be skinny, but they pack a high cadence punch! I always wear gloves on a bicycle too, as I have had many off road and on road 'incidents' resulting in hand rash. On one occasion I ripped up my fave shorts, and in the process lost a bit of my leg and elbow while doing a 25mph on road jump into my brother's back wheel. Not good....but it's my choice to wear shorts to stay cool, and the same applies to motorbikes me thinks. Around London, it is so uncomfortable stuck in traffic cooking in leathers from engine heat that I resort to jeans on occasion, even if they offer buggoer all protection. At least if I am comfy I can concentrate on the road and not on unsticking my leg.

[Jim66a]

There's some pretty `cool` mesh gear with armour at possible contact points in the bike shops. If i was in some warmer country I'd be having a good look at that.
Did anyone see Muggers `off'`in the second race at Brands WSB last weekend. Hit his head hard enough on the tarmac to shatter his visor.. Thats gotta hurt But without a helmet I'd bet he wouldn't be around for the next race.

[Duncan]

Whilst its currently peoples right to choose protective gear, it wont be if the idiots who think they have Carbon Kevlar skin keep getting carted off to hospital.

Personally I always wear leather gloves, boots and a jacket as the first things that come in contact with road are the hands, elbows and feet. Lets face it, damaged hands - cant work, damaged feet - cant walk. I dont do with dressing like a Ninja turd as I like to be able to move about and get off the bike and walk around.

If people dont take some degree of personal responsibility then the legislators will act and make it worse for all of us.

I wonder if those in shorts and t shirts would do the same again after a serious dose of gravel rash and scrubbing with the stiff brush to get it clean.

[JMo]

There's some pretty `cool` mesh gear with armour at possible contact points in the bike shops. If i was in some warmer country I'd be having a good look at that.

Somebody asked about this the other week... I have the Dainese Multisport jacket, and it's great for off-road - but the problem is the plastic panels are really designed for impact protection, not abrasion - and certainly the rest of the mesh suit isn't going to stop you shaving skin off if you slide down the tarmac...

Still, it would be better than nothing...

xxx

PS. As for the cheaper nylon versions, you may as well wear an Ann Summers bodystocking and some knee sliders for all the good it would do you... x

[Mr Cake]

I agree with the right to choose what you wear, but I reckon that the NHS should have no sympathy on riders who are wheeled into A&E having incurred injuries that could have easily been avoided if the proper gear had been worn.

Dave

PS. Jim66a - You had your picture taken with my fave MCN bird. I'm hoping to catch up with her at Oulton Park BSB :D

[Nonnie]

you may as well wear an Ann Summers bodystocking and some knee sliders for all the good it would do you... x
Oh God I really must invest in something a little more suitable to wear...

[MilesB]

Oh God I really must invest in something a little more suitable to wear...
:D :D :D

[JMo]

I reckon that the NHS should have no sympathy on riders who are wheeled into A&E having incurred injuries that could have easily been avoided if the proper gear had been worn.


I can see what you are trying to say Dave, but I would suggest that noone goes out to have an accident - whether they fall off or are knocked off - it would a bit harsh if the NHS started to discriminate depending on what came through their doors... (that's not to say they don't already - drunks on a Saturday night - "does that antiseptic sting sir?", "another stitch for good measure..." etc. )

xxx

[Jim66a]

PS. Jim66a - You had your picture taken with my fave MCN bird. I'm hoping to catch up with her at Oulton Park BSB :D

I heard a rumour that there was some bike racing going on near where I had that pic taken too ;)

[w108rna]

Its one of the arguements that will always go on.

I wear casual clothes but always gloves and boots on casual trips. I wear leathers if i'm going out for a long run-out at speed.

I think the reason why we 'have to' wear the gear, is that Firefighters and Coppers who have to scoop up all the bits if something does go wrong, have better and more pleasant things to do then pick up body parts. Yes, i know its there job etc etc, but no-one wants to be doing that all the time.

[The Kevlar Kid]

I'll wear nothing less than ice skates, a sleeveless denim wastecoat,a ra-ra skirt and an unwashed collinder. :D

Is it just me, or is this all getting a little dull :confused:

[Mr Cake]

I think the reason why we 'have to' wear the gear, is that Firefighters and Coppers who have to scoop up all the bits if something does go wrong, have better and more pleasant things to do then pick up body parts.
But the last I heard, the only legal protective requirement was a lid.

Dave

[A Yerbury]

I wear a cape, kinky boots, fake tan and my heart on my sleeve.
Alice.xxx

ps.this thread is becoming wearing....

[Mr Cake]

ps.this thread is becoming wearing....
No pun intended, eh Yerbs?

Dave

[A Yerbury]

of course, you get 2 points! however you will be docked 1 point for doubting my punning ability...

Axel.

[SAMMYE]

Changing the subject slightly I have it on good authority (local landlord) that the government are going to start fineing people who commit suicide too!!When were it all end??

[CK & AK]

http://www.washingtonriders.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1739&page=1&pp=10

Pics................

[Spike]

If you go down the road of what if you'd never ride the bike in the first place. It's your choice at the moment. I'm still against the helmet law but that's my choice as to who ever posted that riding a bikes reckless enough already why are you even thinking about getting a bike :burnout:

[Nonnie]

My view..

You may think I'm a prat in the sunshine with my full leathers on. I couldn't care less.

I may think you're a prat in the sunshine with your shorts and sandals on. I couldn't care less.

[Mand]

My view..

You may think I'm a prat in the sunshine with my full leathers on. I couldn't care less.

I may think you're a prat in the sunshine with your shorts and sandals on. I couldn't care less.


Nonnie, if you care about my opinion :D I agree with you 100% - my thoughts entirely.

[jill]

as to who ever posted that riding a bikes reckless enough already why are you even thinking about getting a bike :burnout:

Spike

Just because I understand the inherent dangers of riding a bike, doesn't mean I don't enjoy it nonetheless. Reckless means 'disregarding consequences or danger' which is exactly what riding a bike entails. My point is that there is no need to add to that danger. The danger comes, generally, from car drivers, not from riding the bike itself...maybe I should have made myself more clear.

I agree that people should choose whether to wear helmets too; it helps with the gene pool.

Regards
whoever

[Fosse Foxfight]

I must admit the sight of people in shorts n t shirts ridin along does make me cringe, and god help em if they come a cropper, but they do so at their own risk n choice.

This is surely the whole point of living and riding bikes in the first place we want freedom we want that escape from being told constantly what we can and cannot do all the time by the do gooders.
Theres a 3rd way on this issue. On the one hand anybody who rides a motorcycle with shorts and t-shirts is a ****ing twat. Anybody who rides a motorcycle without a helmet is a ****ing twat trying to live some kind of rediculous dream. But everybody should have the choice!. However, for those like the "victims" in AK/CKs post, anybody who is treated for wounds inflicted in a motorcycle accident while not wearing sensible protection should be charged full price for the treatment.
Reckon that only fair?
When I used to ride in a club and wear ripped originals, I did a wonderful slider landed full on my knees and slid on em. One of the ladies in the club scrubbed my knees with a toothbrush to remove the gravel and cleaned them up with surgical spirit.........I paid in pain for being a twat......I dont wear anything less than leathers at all now.


ta ra

[Lost Again]

My point is that there is no need to add to that danger. The danger comes, generally, from car drivers, not from riding the bike itself...

I've been down the road twice at 80 odd mph, not another car in sight.

Meep Meep, Bwaaaarp.

P.S. I also understand the inherent dangers of opening bottles witn my teeth and babybel's with machetes

[jill]

I've been down the road twice at 80 odd mph, not another car in sight.

Meep Meep, Bwaaaarp.

P.S. I also understand the inherent dangers of opening bottles witn my teeth and babybel's with machetes

Yes, of course, not accounting for the terminally-vertically-challenged! :D

PS: But doing both at the same time is quite safe.

[crust]

However, for those like the "victims" in AK/CKs post, anybody who is treated for wounds inflicted in a motorcycle accident while not wearing sensible protection should be charged full price for the treatment.
Reckon that only fair?


Do you also think smokers should pay for their cancer treatment?

People who drink should pay for liver treatment?

Pregant women should pay for maternity treatment?

Surely everyone pays for their treatment.

:confused: Crust

[stef]

Do you also think smokers should pay for their cancer treatment?


People who drink should pay for liver treatment?

Pregant women should pay for maternity treatment?



YES, YES and NOPE (not a self inflicted disease).
(where is this thread heading now ?)

[crust]

YES, YES and NOPE (not a self inflicted disease).
(where is this thread heading now ?)

along the worrying lines of some bright spark insurance person deciding that not wearing 'approved' clothing could reduce a payout, followed not so shortly by an mp deciding that we should be protected from ourselves and made to wear 'approved' clothing.

Another nail in the coffin of motorcycling.

Not to mention that 'approved' clothing will cost an arm and a leg ;)

:) Crust

[A Yerbury]

Chicks dig bikes, they dig scars even more. Do the math(s)

[CraigMac]

I have quite a small scar on my elbow, caused by a staple that was sticking out of a notice board at school.
I should have considered legal action, but in those days we didnt have men on the telly who looked like a bull walrus, advising us on matters of compensation.......Shame, as im sure id have cleaned up!!!
Having said that, it does make me look hard.

Regards.

[A Yerbury]

Did the notice board warn of a potentially hazardous wayward staple? that would have been a bit ironic maybe? nice to see you back in any case.

fond regards.

Alex.

[CraigMac]

No one had carried out a risk assessment......they just didnt care in those days....the 70s.....It was very dangerous, I was one of the lucky ones to survive even though I had a feather cut and later a bubble perm and looked like Peter Framptons love child.....How shocking!!

Alex, thankyou for your kind welcome home.....

Regards

Craig...(Still in trauma)....(Which is just south of Mancunia).....which sounds a bit like Manchuria....but isnt...of course....

[Fosse Foxfight]

Do you also think smokers should pay for their cancer treatment?

People who drink should pay for liver treatment?

Pregant women should pay for maternity treatment?

Surely everyone pays for their treatment.

:confused: Crust
Smokers yes,
liver transplants for habitual alcoholics yes

Pregnant women?....dont be silly

ta ra

[spacemonkey]

I think the reason why we 'have to' wear the gear, is that Firefighters and Coppers who have to scoop up all the bits if something does go wrong, have better and more pleasant things to do then pick up body parts. Yes, i know its there job etc etc, but no-one wants to be doing that all the time.

Oh not again... I'm biting my tongue...... :p

[A Yerbury]

No one had carried out a risk assessment......they just didnt care in those days....the 70s.....It was very dangerous, I was one of the lucky ones to survive even though I had a feather cut and later a bubble perm and looked like Peter Framptons love child.....How shocking!!

Alex, thankyou for your kind welcome home.....

Regards

Craig...(Still in trauma)....(Which is just south of Mancunia).....which sounds a bit like Manchuria....but isnt...of course....

I think you have very good grounds there to sue the 70's? speak to Nik the beefcake as he know's lots and lots about all this legal jargon, I'm just here for the craic like.

good luck!
Alex.