Drilling Carbon

[Plum]

I have a DP belly pan in carbon, which looks like a swiming pool if left out in the rain. I need to drill a couple of drain holes to stop this. Question is, knowing how flimsy this stuff is, which would be the best way? I was going to start with a Dremel and very small drill bit, and sort of work from there.

Any suggestions?

Ta

L

[Albie]

Its not too bad but it does splinter edges a bit if not careful. Much like glass fibre but harder and blunts drills.Mask with tape first to stop slipping. :D

[A Yerbury]

It drills fine, dont make the holes too small as they may block. Drills, Files easy and is far from flimsy!

[NBs]

A 25mm hole should work, meets acu regs too!
Mask it up, then drill a nice big hole.
Take the masking tape off and pencil a 25mm circle around the hole and enlarge the hole with your Dremmel and a sanding drum attachment. The edges will stay clean.

[SimonH]

NBs is right, you need to tape the carbonfibre sheet on either side, this reduces but will not totally stop splintering. If you have a power drill then it is a good idea to invest in a hole cutter (available in DIY shops ) of the right diameter.
1) Always drill CF from the gel coat (shiny) side.
2) Back the area you want to drill with a piece of wood, so as you have something to press against.
3) Don't press too hard.

SimonH

[Spike]

Last time I drilled the stuff I used a wood drill the type that have slightly raised outer edges along with tape on the surface to be drilled no splintering and a nice smooth hole.

[CraigMac]

I knew that you'd reply to this......stand by!!!

[Bob Dixon]

Drilling holes in carbon will not present any problems and all the tips about using masking tape etc are worth adhering to, if you'll pardon the pun. The one thing I would add to this thread is to be mindful that carbon dust is quite unpleasant stuff so make sure you aren`t squinting right up to the job and breathing the dust in, its rather nasty. A mask would be a good idea even for such a small job. The dust will be an irritant if you get in on your skin so wear gloves or whatever. I work with the carbon fibre all day so I can speak with the benefit of some experience on this matter. There won`t be a gelcoat as such [at least there shouldn`t be!], but there will be a shiny side and this is the best side to start your drilling on. A well made piece of carbon will be naturally shiny, most parts that you find on motorbikes aren`t particularly well made and Ducatis are no exception. Ducati parts are usually [but not always] lacquered to make them look pretty.
Hot tip; If you want to restore your tatty looking carbon parts to their former glory get some Kiwi parade gloss black boot polish [actually any old stuff will do.....] and rub it into the carbon with a soft cloth. Buff to a shine , stand back and admire your handiwork........

[Plum]

Thanks for all the info guys, i will let you know how i get on.

Bob - Is it really true about polishing old carbon with boot polish? I just dont want to look a knob when i do it or pass on the hint to others

[A Yerbury]

Bob knows a thing or two about looking at knobs, but I've heard this boot polish tip before so it may be true?
Alex.

[Bob Dixon]

Thanks for all the info guys, i will let you know how i get on.

Bob - Is it really true about polishing old carbon with boot polish? I just dont want to look a knob when i do it or pass on the hint to others

Plum,
Would I post something on a forum just to get a cheap laugh?......
Joking apart, it`s a genuine tip!
Here's the full lowdown if you want fantastic looking carbon;
Polish the carbon using T cut . This will start tto shine it up but will leave micrscopic white bits in the imperfections in the carbon. The boot polish will fill these and disguise them, for also gives the carbon a lovely waxy shine.
Now some technical stuff;
The carbon on your bike will have been made using one of two methods. Wet lay up or pre preg [ pre impregnated carbon cloth] Many people think this gives a superior finish, which is not necessarily true. Pre preg does ensure that you have an exact weight of resin impregnated into each sq. metre of cloth . This is very important from a cost point of view and also important if you need to calculate the finished weight/strength of a component, for instance in a race car chassis. Wet lay up is a bit more hit and miss because the resin is introduced by the operative and the amount introduced into the dry carbon can vary depending on the skill and experience of the operator. It can however give excellent results. I use wet lay up in my workshop because I like the simplicity of it and we get good results with it, however we only make seats and fairings, none of which are stress bearing components, if we were making forks or chassis I would use pre-preg and apply a bit more science to the job.. Pre preg cloth is cut to size, placed in the mould, vacuum bagged and then is generally cured in an oven or an autoclave [pressurised oven], known as a 'clave in the trade. There are some room temperature cure prepregs but these are not commonly used.Prepreg doesn`t necessarily come out very shiny, this is because it should have only just enough resin to fill the gaps in the carbon fibres, which can give the component a dullish finish. If it's a resin-heavy pre preg cloth it will have a better surface finish because there is more resin floating around in the mould and this tends to give a better surface finish,.assuming that the mould is in good nick. Most people forget that carbon is primarily used as a means of saving weight and aesthetics are a secondary issue. This is why it would be unthinkable to use a heavy gel coat with a carbon component. It would completely negate the benfits of using carbon in the first place. Ideally carbon should have just enough resin within the fibres to meet the strength requirements of the designer. This won`t necessarily provide a glossy finish. Manufacturers overcome this by lacquering it.
I make lightweight cycle components and we don`t lacquer them because it would add unecessary weight. We overcome this by using highly polished moulds [which imparts a shine onto the component] and then using boot polish to cover up any minor imperfections

If you can remember all that you should be able to really impress your mates down the pub...

[dean]

Plum,
Would I post something on a forum just to get a cheap laugh?......
Joking apart, it`s a genuine tip!
Here's the full lowdown if you want fantastic looking carbon;
Polish the carbon using T cut . This will start tto shine it up but will leave micrscopic white bits in the imperfections in the carbon. The boot polish will fill these and disguise them, for also gives the carbon a lovely waxy shine.
Now some technical stuff;
The carbon on your bike will have been made using one of two methods. Wet lay up or pre preg [ pre impregnated carbon cloth] Many people think this gives a superior finish, which is not necessarily true. Pre preg does ensure that you have an exact weight of resin impregnated into each sq. metre of cloth . This is very important from a cost point of view and also important if you need to calculate the finished weight/strength of a component, for instance in a race car chassis. Wet lay up is a bit more hit and miss because the resin is introduced by the operative and the amount introduced into the dry carbon can vary depending on the skill and experience of the operator. It can however give excellent results. I use wet lay up in my workshop because I like the simplicity of it and we get good results with it, however we only make seats and fairings, none of which are stress bearing components, if we were making forks or chassis I would use pre-preg and apply a bit more science to the job.. Pre preg cloth is cut to size, placed in the mould, vacuum bagged and then is generally cured in an oven or an autoclave [pressurised oven], known as a 'clave in the trade. There are some room temperature cure prepregs but these are not commonly used.Prepreg doesn`t necessarily come out very shiny, this is because it should have only just enough resin to fill the gaps in the carbon fibres, which can give the component a dullish finish. If it's a resin-heavy pre preg cloth it will have a better surface finish because there is more resin floating around in the mould and this tends to give a better surface finish,.assuming that the mould is in good nick. Most people forget that carbon is primarily used as a means of saving weight and aesthetics are a secondary issue. This is why it would be unthinkable to use a heavy gel coat with a carbon component. It would completely negate the benfits of using carbon in the first place. Ideally carbon should have just enough resin within the fibres to meet the strength requirements of the designer. This won`t necessarily provide a glossy finish. Manufacturers overcome this by lacquering it.
I make lightweight cycle components and we don`t lacquer them because it would add unecessary weight. We overcome this by using highly polished moulds [which imparts a shine onto the component] and then using boot polish to cover up any minor imperfections

If you can remember all that you should be able to really impress your mates down the pub...

Wow, what a post!, so boot polish really works then!?

[Bob Dixon]

Wow, what a post!, so boot polish really works then!?

Indeed it does Dean, and did you know that when I pour polyester resin over my boots it gives them a robust high gloss coating....just like boot polish . Sometimes the truth is stranger than fiction........